**KAZ**

There is no pain from the pepper. Test it on myself all the time....I work with glass....dont you guys think I cut myself..........and OFTEN ?!

They made derogatory comments to my helpful answers there and also garnished support from "friends" to give my answers negatives to appear that I was not being helpful at all but misinforming the person asking the question. This was followed by a vitriolic email to me from the person who refused to accept a reply email. I have reported them to admin of Yahoo for the email.She is talking out of her A$$ upon pure conjecture in her made up fairy world mind. She either believes that a breeder who breeds a number of birds is a bird mill, OR her way to gain a foothold up the yahoo ladder of respect is to pull me down. I am not phased....I can live with myself....I can sleep at night. None of this mud will stick. However she has gathered a group who believe what she says and are acting upon that advice. Why am I active on Yahoo ? Because there are so many idiots giving bad answers that I am trying to help those that need help. There has to be a balance. More good advisors are needed there.The first answer everyone gives there at the furst sign of two budgiues kissing beaks is ...........ADD A NESTBOX Not one asks the age of the budgies at all.I am trying to steer some in the right direction for the birds sake. I wont stop answering there or give up or cancel my membership. Most of what makes ME , ......ME.....is I like to help people. its too ingrained in me to change now Karma ....Yeah...so true

This young man is developing nicely and it occurs to me ( thanks to daryl ) that he needs a name ?

Doesnt take google long to pick up on topics does it What Is Your Definition Of A Bird Mill ? - The Budgerigar Breeders ... 21 posts - 6 authors - Last post: 12 hours ago I have been accused of running a bird mill and told I will be in jail for animal abuse. Animal abuse ? based on suggesting pepper is a good ... forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index.php?showtopic=27919... - 12 hours ago http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....view=getnewpost

They are quill mites arent they Matt ? Not the average feather mite ?

That cage would be great I have it myself :rofl:

well done Finnie

Click for slideshow Budgies in the junior flights were having a great time with the peppermint tree branches in the aviary

Wish I could help but you most likely know how I feel about pellets :rofl: In saying this, our budgies are enjoying the rabbit and guinea pig pellets with their seed, when they wont touch budgie pellets

You breed pigeons too Macka ?

and now all grown up before and now Looking at this bue cock and how pale he was before and how dark now, maybe there is hope for some of the pale ones

http://www.petstorecruelty.org/Birdmills.htm Most bird mill breeding facilities resemble warehouses. Breeder birds, many of them former pets, are kept in small cages with nothing more than food, water, and a nestbox. They are never handled or given any mental stimulation. Confinement in such conditions leads to neurotic behavior in many breeder birds. Not all breeder birds are compatible with each other. If introductions are not carefully done with acute observation and possible intervention--and they rarely are in bird mills--one or both birds of a prospective breeding pair can be seriously injured or killed. If a pair does successfully breed and a female lays fertile eggs, they are removed from the nestbox and placed in an incubator. Chicks are not allowed any contact with their parents. Assembly line-type tubes are used to put food directly into the baby birds' crops. This tube feeding makes it very hard for a chick to be weaned later on because the chick associates eating with a tube instead of food. Bird mills wean baby birds using a technique called deprivation, or forced, weaning. During deprivation weaning, chicks are refused formula with the assumption that when they get hungry enough they'll eat solid food. Deprivation weaning can result in malnutrition, starvation, and permanent behavior problems. Most bird mills wean chicks to cheap seed-only diets in order to save money. This can cause serious health problems and often makes it difficult for the birds to be converted to a more nutritious diet later on. The birds the mills are unable to wean are often turned over to inexperienced pet shop employees, who in turn sell the fragile creatures to uninformed buyers. These unfortunate birds usually starve to death or die at the hands of misdirected people attempting to handfeed them. Another practice in bird mills is the prophylactic use of antibiotics as a substitute for good sanitation. This can have terrible short-term as well as long-term effects on the birds: broad-spectrum antibiotics destroy the beneficial flora and fauna residing in birds, leaving them even more susceptible. Fragile organs can be damaged and some birds have built up resistance to certain types of antibiotics. The less obvious result of production breeding in bird mills is young parrots that have not been handled or socialized. These chicks often develop serious behavioral problems as they mature and make horrible pets. Across the country bird rescue groups are overflowing with abandoned birds--no doubt most the result of production breeding in bird mills.

Did anyone observe the

I would advise the vet take a look....mention the name of the condition in case your vet is unfamiliar with it.......try for an avian vet not a normal vet. I have had some females with this and it hasnt caused them any other problems that was evident. BUT it would pay to be sure especially if there was an underlying condition causing it that could be remedied

She has what is called Hypertrophy of the cere. Here is some information for you Hypertrophy of the Cere This so-called "brown hypertrophy" may be likened to catarrh of a mucous surface and occurs in many types of chronic ill health. Apparently it is not caused by local infection, and ideally treatment consists of finding and treating the underlying cause. The cere should be treated also by picking away the heaped-up material and applying a little oily lotion, cod liver oil, Dettol or bland ointment. Below is a picture of a Budgie with hypertrophy of the cere. The growth can sometimes be caused by mites or tumours.

I was taught a long time ago that the best way to stop the bleeding that was occurring from an attacked chick was with white pepper. I had leanrt previously to use flour from this forum and other places. Flour was very messy. I decided to give the pepper a goas the advisor was a budgerigar breeder of some standing and he was most insistant. Well, it worked better and faster than the flour method with a whole lot less mess. So, I have always advised it myself when we have such questions as my budgie is bleeding etc etc. Today I have received a lot of abuse over such advice. I have been threatened with being reported for animal cruelty as well as being told I was running a bird mill. I am putting it out there...................is pepper a good blood stopper or not ? Anyone else use it ? If anyone has, what results ? The results of internet searches give you these answers and interestingly enough also black pepper and cayenne pepper is advised for stopping bleeding http://tipnut.com/stop-bleeding-ground-black-pepper/ Q. Last night I sliced my finger on the inside of a can that I was rinsing out. It was a fairly significant cut. I rinsed it and applied pressure, then went to the cupboard and pulled out a packet of black pepper (which had been stored in the cupboard specifically to treat cuts). I put black pepper on the bleeding cut and then bandaged it and it seemed fine. After a few minutes, I started to think maybe it wasn't such a good idea to put pepper into an open wound. I decided to rinse out the cut and make sure it was clean, then wrap it again and start over. But when I took the bandage off, the bleeding had stopped and the cut was basically sealed. I rinsed it and put a new bandage on. This morning, I looked again and it hardly looks like there was a cut at all, though it's still quite tender. I’m amazed this worked so well! A. Thanks for your story. Other readers have reported that ground black pepper does seem to help stop bleeding, but a serious cut requires medical attention instead of home remedies. My accuser writes.................. am I wrong ?

:rofl: :rofl: you are a "deep thinker" mate For any that dont get why I am sharing this with you guys............... I and this forum is about educating where possible. The next person out there who decides to google about bird mill topics will find this here.....it all helps to clear the air or mud as the case may be

Well said :rofl: :rofl: Thankyou so much for getting the point GB Excellent post and great definition of bird mill or not Thanks for taking the time to get the point and write this up mate .....

Fine, then fight fire with fire and out them : Name and Shame! Such brave people as this send nasty emails but block a reply. Anything written "online" in public by me will make me wear the punishment not the sneaky person who has accused me. So put up and shut up then .... don't mean to be nasty but I can't see what your alternatives are other than the ones I have suggested. Renee, you may have a different way to me and I respect that. However, my way is..... 1. They person has been reported for the abusive email as is my right 2. I cannot do anything in public as it is against rules How I am dealing with this cr*p is. I debate it here. Google will pick it up. She will read it too as she is watching. Others by reading who may have wondered at what point a breeder becomes a "bird mill" will have their silent questions answered, Her followers will read it also. Not everything is about smacking horns together in a do or die battle. For the silly moo who has accused me of animal cruelty worth jailing.........read my aviary topic here http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....showtopic=14142 and then tell me I am a bird mill. Read my profile here http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index.php?showuser=1976 and all my topics here http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....ult_type=topics and when you are done "eating crow" you can apologise.........................bird mommy

okay thanks, do i need to join up first? Register and then log in

Fine, then fight fire with fire and out them : Name and Shame! Such brave people as this send nasty emails but block a reply. Anything written "online" in public by me will make me wear the punishment not the sneaky person who has accused me.

:raincloud: Yep and since a lot here breed more than I do....that makes the others more bird millers than me

The person has an agenda.....they slander me as a top contributor with solid good answers and they then go up the ladder and take my position. In doing this they also have been gathering support from others. Upset...maybe. But cannot believe that people believe this cr*p without real knowledge and act upon one persons say so. By The Way.......our forum has been described as My intentions here are..........lets debate the real meaning of bird mills with correct info, so those that google bird mills will know what one is and what one isnt.

I know. I was not addressing the bird mill phrase in relation to anything you said :raincloud: