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Now that he can come out of his cage safely I let him out more often. I had stopped his "out of cage" activity when I became a nervous wreck with him flying around rather eratically. (the flying was great, it was the landing!!!). I'm starting gently naturally as the floor is new to him. I put the cage on the floor open it up, put his toys in front of it, including a play gym I have recently purchased, its nothing spectacular, just a plastic one from the petshop. (I've seen some brilliant home made ones on this forum but just not time to do this myself). I then sit on the floor with him and play for a little while, rolling the ball, which he can't resist chasing, then after a little while when he's lost interest, I just grab my laptop, sit on the floor away a little.. and do my own thing, watching him and talking to him. He is happy out for awhile but is still happier returning to his cage, in it or on top of it. I would expect that I guess. I wont rush him but eventually will try to shut his cage and see what he does. Plan is to get him to "run" more to chase his toys. He still flutters from place to place so I think once I can build up his confidence being out and on the floor I should be able to encourage him to walk (run!) around a little more which hopefully will assist with his weight. I've also taken his seed out for a few hours (he tends to graze all day long!!) and am watching to see if he opts for the pellets. As yet he wont go near them. But lets not forget this is only really day 2! As you all point out on this forum, budgies can be stubborn and creatures of habit. I have always found it really bizarre that when I sit and have my dinner (he can see me) he starts eating as well. I have often asked myself... does he really KNOW I'm eating.. or is it just coincidence?? ... are you able to ascertain if he is VERY porky by these photos taken today???

Here some shots of Charley playing on the floor. He's never been floor level before so it was quite exciting (for me!!). I so enjoyed watching him and playing with him. ...getting a different view of the world?? (Forgive me guys for showing off.. but heck.. I'm so happy that he's alive and well!!! and that I can now play with him, without him flying away!!!)

Sunny looks like he's sitting there with his body guards! Too cute!!!! :yes:

I do see that there must be a benefit in giving the pellets, it was the "take away the seed" aspect altogether that surprised me. She was adament that seed was bad for them. okay they are probably high in fat content hence me offering to mix the pellets with the seed but she said no, he will just pick out the seed and leave the pellets. Just pellets and of course fruit and veges. I admit he does have access to seed all day long and he IS a little piggy who tends to eat frequently. If there were pellets available from somewhere OTHER than a special trip to the vet I am open to giving it a go. I am not comfortable with having to drive to the vet each fortnight for a 1.25kg $24 bag of pellets which I cant buy ANYWHERE else, to me that seems like a bit "specialised". Its not just the cost, its the principal. Can anyone suggest if there are other brands of suitable pellets which are easier to obtain??? I'm thinking of perhaps keeping on using the two separate food dishes but now and then taking the seed one out to see if he gets hungry enough to investigate the pellets (not to a degree of him starving of course!!!). So far he sniffs the pellets and seems to go "blahhh!!" .. wont touch them. Also.. he seems to "play" with his fruit and veges moreso than eat them, is this still counted as getting his share of fruit and vegies? He is loving his new branches (no more perches) and enjoys chewing the uneven bits. I'm scouring the forum for other ideas of things he can have to chew on and pull apart. I've found a few good ideas so far. (he loves to tear things up and I line his cage floor with the sandpaper type sheets which he nibbles at until there are untidy holes in them everywhere. MB she is the vet nurse in a well known avian vet surgery. Seems to be experienced however there did seem to be predominantly larger "patients", i.e parrots, galahs etc. with budgies and smaller birds being the minority. The pellets they sell are quite small, however still a lot larger than the seed he is used to. They also have a very strong odour which I wondered if that may be putting him off also. (I dont know how strong their sense of smell is?)

Wow thats all great advice. I did think it strange that she said NO SEED at all, put him totally on the pellets (and it has to be the pellets they sell at $24 a packet of 1.25kg. I asked can I buy it from supermarket or petshop, she said no, we have it here). Asked could I mix it. No she said. Two dishes, one with pellets, one with seed and gradually reduce the seed until he gets none. I was previously buying normal budgie mix from the petshop and was proud that I always bought "good quality" seed especially mixed for budgies!! I didnt understand her reasoning, she said birds in the wild dont have access to seed all the time so its wrong to feed it to our caged birds. Charley does love veges although I always suspect he plays with them more than eats them.. but then he'd probably be doing just that "in the wild as well". He wont even LOOK at the dish with the pellets and although I've made the seed dish a little more awkward to get to, he doesnt mind! He'll hang upside down and eat if he has to. Another thing that confused me.. she examined him and said he had a good strong little body, very healthy, happy, GREAT little guy!! His only flaw was a few grams overweight. Now should you really take such a healthy little body and completely change his diet? Could he not then eat too little, become "emancipated", ill, listless and . .. lo and behold... off to the vet because he's malnourished? Is it perhaps a case of "if it ain't broke don't fix it"..?? I am happy to give him both.. pellets and seeds (and veges) but I'm not happy to take him completely off budgie seed mix.. and am a little afraid that, great as the vet is, they are wanting people to buy their product to "feather their own nest" (pardon the pun!). Going by the advice from you guys on this forum, it seems quite okay to continue to feed him "proper budgie mix". I really appreciate the comments. I was totally confused!!!

I am no help to you .. but am interested to see what the experienced members post as advice to you. My female budgie, Maxie just will not become tame. Charley is as tame as they get. Maxie tries hard to bite me. If I adjust her branch in her cage, even from OUTSIDE the cage, she sits and makes the biting moves with a nasty little look on her face, as if to say "you come any closer and I'll get you!!!!" So I'm looking forward to the replies you get!! Good luck with Bluebell.. she should be okay though as she was sitting on your finger at one stage. Maxie has never been social, ever!!

Charley seems fine today. I have to admit, I slept very little last night (he sleeps in my bedroom). I just couldnt relax. In the middle of the night I was ALMOST tempted to check on him but thought better to let him rest after his stressful evening. This morning I held my breath when I lifted his cover (I'm sure you ALL know that feeling!!!!!) I was almost too afraid to look. He was on his perch, looked at me sideways (as they do!) and said "what are you doing?" PHEW!! He was fine!! I could have kissed him! His droppings were a little different today, a bit runnier and green, I'm presuming its due to the worming syrup she gave him? I did take the vet's advice, got rid of the perches and put in some branches, different thicknesses. He loves them. While I was redecorating his house he escaped, fluttered and landed gently on my bed. I was able to just pick him up and put him back in the cage. I then put the whole cage on the floor, opened the doors and took out his little ladder, setting it against the cage on the outside, took his toys out and started rolling his favourite little plastic ball on the carpet. He was soon interested enough to hop on my hand and onto the floor. He had never been on the floor before (always flew away.. up somewhere high!). His cage is also higher up on a bookcase, about my eye level. I put the cage back up there when we've finished "playing". He found the carpet so interesting.. kind of nibbling at it, walking on it, then he started kicking the ball around and walked up his ladder back into his cage (he loves his cage... even at the vets she put him on the table and he fluttered straight into his cage. It was a nice feeling to know he feels so secure there.) I also have a smaller branch which I propped up onto the outside of the cage and against the open cage door, so that he had somewhere to perch just off the ground. I will keep adding to it this way so that he has a kind of play gym when he's out. I find on the floor is ideal (I live alone so not a great deal of danger in being stepped on!) as I sit on the floor with him and we have "playtime" together. This is what I have wanted so badly to do for so long but he always flew away. I am thrilled that we can now spend more time together. As he gets more confident walking around on the floor, or fluttering around he can be out of his cage more when I'm there. I am dying to take some photos of him playing but will wait until he's a little more comfortable with it.

Following Charley's debut at the avian vet... he's been labelled as a bit of a porker. :tut_tut: He's not FAT but she said a little too heavy. She did say he's a very healthy, strong, "well built" little guy, just a LITTLE too heavy. She suggested its usually diet based.. and advised against giving him bird seed as it is the bird equivalent to being on a fried chips diet. I always presumed bird seed was for birds. But...I bought a bag of their pellets, and she suggested that initially I put two dishes out, normal seed in a harder to get to spot and the pellets in an obvious spot. So far he's heading straight to the "harder to get" spot! I'm wondering if you can offer me any other (additional) hints to slimming Charley down a little. The pellet idea is fine but can you buy it normally in a pet shop? The 1.25kg bag was close on $24 and I may be wrong but that seems rather costly, is there a more economical alternative? I'm no scrooge but am hesitant to pay that kind of money (2 budgies go through 1.25kgs very quickly as you all know!!) if there is other feed out there which would do the trick just as well. I'm also not particularly keen on racing off to the vet (its a little out of the way) every week (or two) to buy food for them. Now that his wings are clipped I will be taking him out more often and playing with him. He loves his little plastic ball so I'm hoping to be able to sit with him and "play ball", hopefully he'll run around a little more! :lol2: Any advice will be welcome!!!

Elly... this was with a recommended avian vet. I think it was the vet nurse. She seemed to be very efficient and examined him thoroughly after the event and said she had no idea what could have caused it. She gave him a good check over, she felt around his neck and crop and said nothing seemed to be wrong there. He didnt seem to be in any pain. The slide smear was of his dropping and was all okay. She also checked him for mites. She was very thorough and I was impressed with her. But... I WAS terrified as I have heard that it doesnt take much blood loss to be "too" much for a little budgie. The bleeding didnt last long at all though so fingers crossed he's fine in the morning. I guess the fact that he's eating and playing is a good sign?

Well that was scarey!! I took Charley in to the avian vet to have his wings clipped. Fine. He was a model patient, didnt try to bite, didnt squawk, just perfect. She loved him. SHe also did a "swab on a slide" test, checked him all over, heartbeat etc all fine.. just needed the worming mixture into his crop, she put the "needle" thing in and assured me it wasnt hurting him,just a little uncomfortable and not very nice tasting. When she pulled the needle out the tip was covered in blood. She seemed a little taken aback and had no idea what this could be. She put him back in his cage for a minute to see how he went. He shook his head and I noticed blood on his eye. I thought he was bleeding from the eye (he wasnt!!!), I felt sick, I had to sit down as I even felt like I was going to faint (weakling????). However aparently it was a little drop of blood that he had shaken onto his eye. She said he had vomited a little which sometimes happens when the worming liquid goes in, although she did say this sort of thing hasnt happened before. She took him back out and wiped him and had another look in his 'mouth' but he seemed fine. The bleeding stopped almost instantly and he was looking quite calm and "normal" again. No longer shaking his head. After a few minutes he was his old self but she said to keep an eye on him tonight. When we were home again he was playing, eating and drinking although I havent heard him chatting yet, but it was late and he'd had a tough time so I'll see how he is in the morning. She said he's a little overweight (she weighed him but I cant remember how many grams he was) and said if he's on bird seed, to try to wean him off it onto the pellets (which I bought from them). She gave me some info on the best way to do this, plus some other documents on health etc. The whole episode cost me $158 which was a BIT of a shock, but always, as you all know, you cant put a price on the love of your little mate!! He seems fine now and quite happy for me to tickle his neck again, not at all afraid of being handled. I'll give him tomorrow to settle down and then on the weekend I'll see how he is coping with his clipped wings... she said if I feel he still has too much flight I can bring him back (or do it myself but I dont like that idea). Phew... it gave me such a terrible fright!! I thought I'd lost my little buddy!! :fear

Thanks. Ely thats just what I was fearing. That the "negative handling" would turn him off being handled by me. and I was afraid they might ask me to hold him while they trim. But I guess an Avian vet would be much wiser to this. .. perhaps moreso than a non avian vet. I've started "holding" him more in my hand this week to get him a little more used to having a hand actually hold him. Up to now I've only really held him with "covered" hand when I've had to pick him up from somewhere to put him back after a (gentle) crash landing. He will of course step up onto my finger but if out of the cage he then takes off again so I sometimeshave to grab him with my hand. He doesnt like it of course but doesnt bite or argue too much. I've started just putting my hand around him in the cage and talking gently to him while giving him a little scratch in his neck (which he loves). He never bites so no worry there (he only nibbles in a very gentle way, almost "lovingly"). he sometimes struggles a little to get loose but I think surely that would be a natural reaction. I then make sure I put him gently back on his perch, still always talking to him with his familiar phrases, the ones he says to me. I feel that lets him see that being handled is not stressful. I am just hoping that the clipping experience wont completely turn him off being handled. I guess I will just have to then keep going with the gentle way I've been doing it lately to gain back his trust.

After putting a lot of thought and research into it I have made an appointment with the local Avian vet for Thursday 5.30pm to have Charley's wings clipped. I cant believe how nervous I am about it!!! It feels like I'll be taking a child to his first day at kindy!! He will be attended to by nurse "Amy" and she will give him a full health check as well. I look at him on his perch, stretching his wings and think to myself .. I wonder if after his "trim" will he sit there looking at his short feathers and think "crikey!! I look like a DORK!!" the way we do when we have a far too short haircut!!! I hope he doesnt get too upset having it done. I wonder how "different" he will feel when he gets home and settles back down. I hope he understands it's all for his own safety.. and not JUST my peace of mind!

Bossy does that too when we put him in his cage to go to bed and he also squawks when we try and put the cover on. It is definately his way of saying "I'M NOT TIRED!!!" "LET ME BACK OUT OF THE CAGE". he also does it during the day for exercise, but without the racket and carry-on that we get when trying to put him to bed Doesnt that just go to show us that they're just like little human people with a mind of their own! I love it when Charley does it, he's so cute and cheeky!! I pretend I'm annoyed and say "you're a bad boy!!" and then next day he sits there with his back to me, in his own little world saying "Charley's a bad bad bad boy!"... and I reckon he knows exactly what he's saying!!

Charley flaps his wings MADLY when its bedtime and I put the cover on. I think its his way of saying "NOOOOOOO!!!! not bedtime!!!! PLEASE!!!" Its rather funny as the cover is a lovely long flowing wrap around skirt, and when he flaps his wings it flies up everywhere and is hard to put over the cage. He knows this and enjoys making it as difficult as possible for me to "put him to bed".

That's bizarre!! Charley also loves Abba best!!!! I guess because they're very catchy and they, like us, cant help singing along! Maxie will only ever come to life and chirp when there's noise. Running water, boiling kettle and also loves to hear me stirring my cuppa!!! When I stop stirring, she stops chirping!

Thanks guys!! I find it so helpful hearing opinions from others on this forum!! I found on this site a recommended Avian vet not too far away (Chermside). I will give them a call re the hours they are open. I am not worried about the cost (just interested so I know what to expect), as of course Charley means everything to me and as you all know, you cant put a price on the love your special little mate gives you!! I just dont want him to hurt and I'm a little worried about watching the clipping (yep.. I'm such a softie!!!!). I wont be able to look!!! But I'm doing it for his own safety. I would be devastated if he hit a wall and I know it can happen quite easily. I've always been a bit doubtful (scared?) of the wing clipping thing but I am now convinced (I think!!) that it is the best thing for my Charley.

AWWWWWW such cute photos!! I love the little chick.. he/she is soooo cute!!!! Cant wait to see how it grows!!!

I know this has been covered many times.. but I need some advice. I'm tossing up whether to get Charleys wings clipped and if so would like some advice of a reliable "wing clipper" in Brisbane. I live on the northside. My reason? He was clipped when I got him and has become very tame, however his flight feathers have of course grown back and he flies well, he just doesnt know when to land!! When he's out he flies around and around until he eventually lands anywhere. Sometimes on the floor sometimes missing the walls by a fraction. I'm TERRIFIED I'm going to lose him by him hitting a wall or getting caught behind something. He enjoys flying but seems to get stressed trying to find when and where to land. I have the top of his cage open with the perch for him to land on but although he heads towards it, he seems to go past and keep going till he runs out of energy and drops down. He loves to be handled but I can only handle him in his cage as I'm terrified of him flying around and getting seriously hurt. I feel that if he is clipped he may be able to spend more time close to me (he loves to kiss and cuddle with me.. providing he cant fly away). I think I could have a much closer relationship with him if he was clipped as we could spend so much more time together. Another question.. if it is done properly does it hurt him (the clipping)? I wouldnt want to hurt him under any circumstances. Also any idea of cost of wing clipping? ANy advice would be appreciated!!!

:question: why oh why did you show all that YUMMY CHOCOLATE!!!!! now i have to "cook" some too!!!! :mallet:

I had lunch with your mom because the voices told me to

I have learnt that loving a little creature covered in feathers does NOT necessarily mean I am crazy!! :chickendance: I have also learnt not to panic if something seems to go wrong with my budgies, that there are experienced members on the forum who can offere advice ...and that I'm never "alone". I have also learnt that there are many wonderful caring members on this forum who keep amazing me with their dedication to caring for the babies, the very old and the very sick birds! :angel1:

I read so often about budgies escaping from aviaries or cages, it terrifies me. I would die if I lost Charley. So I keep it in mind all the time. I make sure the room is "bird safe" whenever I leave now, I stop, look around and try to imagine if he was to escape from his cage into the room is there any harm he can come to. I ensure doors are shut (to bathrooms), windows closed etc. Then when I come home I make a point of opening the door carefully and checking immediately if he's in his cage. So sorry to read about the mum flying off, so sad for you. I will keep checking the forum to hear how your babies are going!! And hopefully will see some photos of them soon. Good luck with the babies, we're all thinking of you!

Good heavens, some people are such experts at everything! :bow: I wonder if he would question my three (human) children (being totally dis-similar and not looking at all like me..) perhaps having been swapped at birth with someone else's perhaps better looking babies! <hastily grabbing photo albums to check for family likenesses> :tut_tut: I'm sure most of us take whatever we read on the forum at face value and we all know there is nothing to be gained by fake "births" or "show results" as those people are only fooling themselves. Kaz we know you are a respected member and if 99% of us support you and congratulate you (on babies or anything else!) then who cares what the other 1% say anyway.

I find also that nothing really works. Mainly due to what seems like constant moulting and the carpet being covered in their "underwear".. also the flapping of excited wings makes husks, feathers and seeds fly around the room and land on the carpet that has just been vacuumed. No amount of "seed catchers" would do the trick. Guess I've just accepted that its a messy business, I have two budgies, in separate rooms and if one is not moulting the other one is however its only a 5 minute job to run the vacuum over it daily.

Crumbs!