Norm

It’s quite possible if you have them breeding in an aviary with other birds that the hen may have mated with another if you have a Cinnamon cock. They may look very faithful, but they are not against having a little on the side. This other pair that you talk about, that has mostly white babies…are you saying that Cloudy is Cinnamon & his mate Smudges is Cinnamon also? If the babies are White with Cinnamon wings, they would be Lacewings…is that what you are saying?

Pity that looked like a nice TCB hen…it seems to me that what ever killed it must have been sudden maybe like some poison, as usually if a bird is slowly getting sick, the cere would have got pale first & it’s cere still looked in a nice dark state. You said at first that it’s beak looked strange, was it overshot or undershot, [can’t remember which is which] where the bottom beak is longer than the top? That makes it difficult for the bird to eat, but that condition would take much longer for the bird to die.

Yes you got the mutations right. Seeing both birds are I think Dominant Pied all young will be Pied & Blue, you will get about 50% Yellow Face & 50% White Faced, you should also get some Opaline hens. Dave...Has that chick had it's adult plumage yet? As the bleed doesn't come in until the first moult. I had a bird that I thought was a type 1, that I bred with a Blue hen, but all the young so far have looked like type 2…they say it's not a good idea to mix the two colours together when you are breeding.

Yes you are correct it is a Yellow Faced Blue Spangle. A beautiful mutation I think. They all look good.

Some Dads are in touch with their feminine side I like that Kaz...(Laughing out loud)... :(Laughing out loud):

From that last picture it certainly looks a little like Cinnamon, if you bred him & he threw some Cinnamon hens you would be sure. The problem of whether he is Greywing or Clearwing is that Greywing, Clearwing & Dilute are apparently the same allele that has mutated three times & you have the added confusion that you can get a Dark Clearwing or a Lighter Greywing. There is always lots of variations in Mutations. That’s part of what showing is about, trying to get the perfect bird of any mutation.

Sunnie, from the fact that it is Cinnamon, you know already that it will be a hen, as the only way you can get a Cinnamon from that pair is if the cock is split Cinnamon & with Cinnamon being what they call a sex linked mutation, he can only throw hens. If you later mate it with a non Cinnamon cock, you wont get any Cinnamons, as a Cinnamon hen can only throw cocks that are split for Cinnamon, but don’t show it visually. To get Cinnamons from her, if that’s what you want you would have to mate her to a split Cinnamon cock or a Cinnamon one.

I'm getting plenty of Lutino hens from my TCB's being split for them, but I'm not getting any progress on my Lacewings, I've still only got the one I bred & one I bought, so far neither have bred. Karen are you going to let them breed again to see if you get some Lacewings the next batch? The bird I bred my Lacewing from also bred Lutinos, I got three Lutino hens & one Lacewing, but the Lacewing was White…so from that result it seems like it was split for Lacewing & also Lutino. I have mated him up with a Cinnamon hen, to hopefully get some more Lacewings but she hasn’t gone down.

Thanks for the update, I hope all goes well.

My pleasure.What I think would be ideal if you had it, was to put him by himself in another cage with food & water so that he could feed & then have time to absorb some of it for himself. Some birds especially cocks can be mad feeders to the determent of themselves. A rest of an hour or two once or twice a day till he calmed down could be good.

You are right about that Zebra, they eat early & late & in the heat of the day sit chatting to each other in the branches of trees. Like they still do in aviaries.

That’s especially nice that he did that for you Kaz, better than wasting them eh? I will be looking to see how they turn out…good luck…

Yes I agree with your assumptions.

Like Kaz says, bird often take some time to learn new foods, just give them a little at a time & remove any uneaten after a few hours, provide it in a small separate dish... I use plastic bottle lids, as it contains egg which can go off in hot weather especially. But the egg content gives the birds more protein & variety than can be obtained in just dry seed.

I agree with Kaz...a Cinnamon Violet...so your dream came true...they say if you wish for something enough it will happen.

Maybe if he's feeding so much, taking him out of the cage to give him a short rest might be a good idea, then return him later, see how much it stresses him out if it stresses him, it wont do that much good.

Yes I agree Opaline Spangles can have lots of Blue in their wings & some have very light black markings. Yellow Faced Blue Spangles can look very much like the Budgie mutation known as Rainbows. Like this bird. http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s133/greenie6666/1.jpg

From your description it sounds like heat stress, but if it’s not hot it could be just exhaustion from feeding the babies. How many batches have they had this time & how many babies in each batch. If he is still feeding well as you say, I don’t think it can be something drastic, as if Budgies get real sick they will sit fluffed up or have signs of diarrhoea around their vent. Some birds can raise many batches without getting exhausted, but others will soon get exhausted & it can kill them. If this batch of young are less than 4 chicks & the hen is well she could raise them herself, but if more it could be too much for her. How old are the oldest chicks in the batch as if they are about 28 days old, they could be removed so that they can start feeding themselves. If you are seeing the vet, maybe it’s best to go by his advise, as he can see your bird.

Yes I'm sure I'm the same Kaz, have been wanting to get some pics of mine to get comfirmation from some of you guys.

Sure will Elly.

Hi Juliet, welcome to the forum...I hope your young Budgies do well, they look good & we can see some more pictures later.

I'm not sure Elly I'm just learning about the difference between Golden Face, Yellow Face & when I was doing that aviary visit a few weeks ago they were talking about Cream Faced...it's a bit of a mistery???

Good luck with those batches Nerwen.

They are hearing plenty of music from other birds & I play the radio when I’m working in the bird room, but nothing has worked. Maybe they just don’t like each other…I haven’t ever even seen the hen look at the nest box, in fact I took it away because I needed it the other week & have some wood to build a new one but I’ve been too busy of late. Lacewing is one Mutation where even the experts don't agree, so I guess we haven't got a chance to know what's what...it's suppose to be on the same allele...Cinnamon & Lutino. And I think TCB is on the same allele too.

I don’t think that question has been answered completely yet Elly…some experts say that it’s a combo of Cinnamon & Lutino, other say it’s separate mutation. I think if it were just a combination, you wouldn’t need to get Lacewings, just breed your Cinnamons & Lutinos together. I have been trying to breed my Lacewing hen to a Cinnamon Green cock, as I don’t have anything else to pair her with, but so far they wont cooperate. I was going to ask you for the site you have been reading about them to see if it’s a different one to the ones I have looked at. I’m still working on the assumption that it’s a Mutation & that it can be also split with Lutino.