Lace hens don't ever seem to have the same feather or power as the cocks so don't try and look at them against cock birds. I think all 3 will be useful birds but 2 would be my pick and 1 would be next pick with 3 being last. But like I said I would have been extatic to have bred a hen lw like chick 3 in the first few years of breeding!

 

Nice job!

Gorgeous chick GB and congrats on the new addition

thank you all i am extatic but in a unsure kind of way i guess ive been told their nothing special by someone so when i though as you did for my first lacewings i thought i should be proud

so thank you gina rach and dave

Go tell that person to pull their head in!

 

That 2nd hen is as good as any I bred this year and I would be very happy to have her! Chick 1 will be very handy too! And okay maybe chick 3 I would not be too fussed about but don't write it off either! Not all chicks in every clutch is going to be top quality. Their size for babies just left the nest if very good (I know the size of the dad and he is not tiny either) and they will make terrific stock hens.

 

Notice at no point did I say "They look cute!" (my standard reply when I think the bird is a **** example of a show bird - just given myself away here..... ooops), I said "I would be very happy with chick number 2 in particular, definitely not unhappy with chick number 1 and keep number 3 in case she develops more.

 

What does this person expect you to breed in your first real attempts at show breeding lacewings anyway? A Nationals winner? Are they the same person who convinced you to get rid of some of your other chicks early too? Hmmm maybe not the advice I'd be listening to.

Give them a chance GB ...........I recall an olive green chick once that was worse than pet sized and after 8 months in the aviary where I really just forgot about letting him go there.........I caught a bird up one day thinking WOW !! Where did you come from ?? and realised once I caught him that he was that pint sized chick with A few extra "muscles and feathers" and wow what time gives to some birds !!

Hasty judgements can result in other benefitting from our culls that do grow on with time

Go tell that person to pull their head in!

 

That 2nd hen is as good as any I bred this year and I would be very happy to have her! Chick 1 will be very handy too! And okay maybe chick 3 I would not be too fussed about but don't write it off either! Not all chicks in every clutch is going to be top quality. Their size for babies just left the nest if very good (I know the size of the dad and he is not tiny either) and they will make terrific stock hens.

 

Notice at no point did I say "They look cute!" (my standard reply when I think the bird is a **** example of a show bird - just given myself away here..... ooops), I said "I would be very happy with chick number 2 in particular, definitely not unhappy with chick number 1 and keep number 3 in case she develops more.

 

What does this person expect you to breed in your first real attempts at show breeding lacewings anyway? A Nationals winner? Are they the same person who convinced you to get rid of some of your other chicks early too? Hmmm maybe not the advice I'd be listening to.

 

 

no it was not

same person

but i only listen to three actually people whom i buy my birds from their stud on a regular bases

and my club president as they know their birds and their history how the chicks develop exec i dont buy random blood anymore just one or two birds that may have something im lacking or missing and still only on seeing their line of birds their breed from

as someone very wize recently told me

unless they have a room full of trophy's then dont listen to a word they say

just i did get disharteded as i thought i did well for lacewings

i was told i wouldnt have much chance breeding them as i would never get to standard of our champion breeders in our club

but i think the boys may enjoy a challenge in the club make it less tardy and tedious so i wont give them in

besides the brothers are very welcoming and helpful not your norm stick in the mud competitive types they more than willing to help or i wouldn't be able to purchases their birds at all if they were so.... and besides i know it took them all years and i know it will take me years also

im in no hurry and its a love a hobby more than competition to me

 

kaz this is too true

Give them a chance GB smile.gif ...........I recall an olive green chick once that was worse than pet sized tongue.gif and after 8 months in the aviary where I really just forgot about letting him go there.........I caught a bird up one day thinking WOW !! Where did you come from ?? ohmy.gif and realised once I caught him that he was that pint sized chick with A few extra "muscles and feathers" and wow what time gives to some birds !!

Hasty judgements can result in other benefitting from our culls that do grow on with time biggrin.gif

Pardon me for asking this but are you actually competing against the champion breeders in your club at this stage?! What grade are you in? Doesn't that mean you compete against other Novices and build up the quality of your birds over time?

Pardon me for asking this but are you actually competing against the champion breeders in your club at this stage?! What grade are you in? Doesn't that mean you compete against other Novices and build up the quality of your birds over time?

 

 

no i dont go up against them

luckly lol

id have no chance in *** so to speak

 

im up against the beginners their are a few of us

then theirs the intermediates and open then champion

but we only have the one set of champion breeders

in our club

 

we get alot of birds on night so its good we dont just win against self for club judging but you do sometimes if your only one with that verity

im not sure exactlyhow it works but they do young birds

ubcs and that like you would at a show then the choose overall best ubc on night and best young bird on night ithink

honestly i really dont understand it all

i was just asking other night who they where up against at club night

intermediate i think or open depending on how many birds i think was answer

but no no i dont go against champion breeder in club thank goodness lol

be pointless trying

 

but what i was saying is that as i work up the ladder im sure the boys would be happy for a new person to put birds against in club that breeds lacewings

 

another person breeds them also

in our club

but i never seen one their yet so

 

i dont plan on staying in beginners to long but i dont expect to be in intermediate to soon either

Just scurried off to look coz I didn't think that Vic had been all that prominent in LW's in the Nats. The year my bird got 4th Vic came 5 & 9 (2008), the year my bird got a 3rd Vic got 7 & 9 (2009). Didn't look at what they got this year so maybe I'm talking out of my bum a bit BUT the birds you have GB are all related to both these boys so in theory your lacewings should have all the potential in the world to mix it with the top LW breeders in your state! And looking at those chicks tells me that you are well on the way! They ARE VERY nice chicks!

Just scurried off to look coz I didn't think that Vic had been all that prominent in LW's in the Nats. The year my bird got 4th Vic came 5 & 9 (2008), the year my bird got a 3rd Vic got 7 & 9 (2009). Didn't look at what they got this year so maybe I'm talking out of my bum a bit BUT the birds you have GB are all related to both these boys so in theory your lacewings should have all the potential in the world to mix it with the top LW breeders in your state! And looking at those chicks tells me that you are well on the way! They ARE VERY nice chicks!

 

Well done Nubbly.

 

This information is what beginning breeders need to help boost their confidence and to help them know the pedigree of their birds, and how they compare. The fact you went and looked to find out how Victoria has done previously shows what a good heart you have in helping another breeding, perhaps future competition even, out.

 

GB is obviously on the right track and your positive reinforcement is a great thing to behold. Well done.

Just scurried off to look coz I didn't think that Vic had been all that prominent in LW's in the Nats. The year my bird got 4th Vic came 5 & 9 (2008), the year my bird got a 3rd Vic got 7 & 9 (2009). Didn't look at what they got this year so maybe I'm talking out of my bum a bit BUT the birds you have GB are all related to both these boys so in theory your lacewings should have all the potential in the world to mix it with the top LW breeders in your state! And looking at those chicks tells me that you are well on the way! They ARE VERY nice chicks!

 

Well done Nubbly.

 

This information is what beginning breeders need to help boost their confidence and to help them know the pedigree of their birds, and how they compare. The fact you went and looked to find out how Victoria has done previously shows what a good heart you have in helping another breeding, perhaps future competition even, out.

 

GB is obviously on the right track and your positive reinforcement is a great thing to behold. Well done.

 

 

i thank you for the encouragement darl and i really thank you for all your help

as dave as said you really do and have gone out their forme

and not justlatley

when i got the boys as if it was not for your kindness and help i would never of got them in first place

 

besides i have faith in me and to be honest if anything gets me up their withmy birds it will be because of that and because im very very choosy with trying to keep my birds to my likeing

 

also second chick today arived

just one slight prob could be the foster chick as they all due today

black eye too so

im sure i will beable to tell when older

eithr way im keeping them all anyways so time will tell the egg was marked but the mark was gone

 

 

 

and dave thank you for your kind remark i hope im on right trake

i know my birds are the best of the worst i could get

and i dont think their is alot of comp with the lacewings i should look it up myself some how or at least ask someone

Edited July 14, 201014 yr by GenericBlue

Well done on the LW babies GB and on beating the odds: 3 hens from a split cock in a single round is pretty damn good! I also like 2-1-3. Finally, please forward the name and number of the breeder who's not so keen on your LW's as I now know where to buy MY next LW's from

They are really nice Gb I like no 1 and 2 then in other pics I change my mind so now I reckon I like the whole 3.... well done

second chick hatched but as a foster also hatched at same time well im not sure who is who

but time will tell

their alive thats what counts :hap:

Woohoo! I had chick #2 pinned from the beginning :hap: Feel so justified by everyone else agreeing with me hahaha. She is a looker!

 

Just a question out there for anyone who might be able to answer it - is opaline problematic in lacewing breeding? I imagine it would not only dull the wing markings, but in some places make it fade out (imagine the faded 'thumb' print some opalines get, or the very non-descript wing markings that are overpowered by body colour).

 

I just noticed the cock was an opaline split lacewing? Is he the father or a foster father? (Wondering if these hens are opaline lacewings, which would be quite the combo?)

Woohoo! I had chick #2 pinned from the beginning :hap: Feel so justified by everyone else agreeing with me hahaha. She is a looker!

 

Just a question out there for anyone who might be able to answer it - is opaline problematic in lacewing breeding? I imagine it would not only dull the wing markings, but in some places make it fade out (imagine the faded 'thumb' print some opalines get, or the very non-descript wing markings that are overpowered by body colour).

 

I just noticed the cock was an opaline split lacewing? Is he the father or a foster father? (Wondering if these hens are opaline lacewings, which would be quite the combo?)

 

 

Here is a lacewing hen I once had and she was opaline.

 

 

 

 

 

It may help you work out about the markings and if it makes a difference

Woohoo! I had chick #2 pinned from the beginning :hap: Feel so justified by everyone else agreeing with me hahaha. She is a looker!

 

Just a question out there for anyone who might be able to answer it - is opaline problematic in lacewing breeding? I imagine it would not only dull the wing markings, but in some places make it fade out (imagine the faded 'thumb' print some opalines get, or the very non-descript wing markings that are overpowered by body colour).

 

I just noticed the cock was an opaline split lacewing? Is he the father or a foster father? (Wondering if these hens are opaline lacewings, which would be quite the combo?)

 

Well it's not a CRITICAL problem as opaline is an allowable combination with lacewing (here in Oz at any rate) but yes you are right it CAN be an issue for the very reasons you mention. Opaline often causes fuzzy indisitinct wing markings in lacewings and in the worst cases cause the nasty thumb print to appear as a patch in the middle of an otherwise marked wing. But having said that...... if a damn good lacewing is opaline, it's still a damn good lacewing.

 

At the moment I am in the process of slowly working away from opaline but not at the expense of bird quality. Anyway it's a pretty hard task. I bought a bird from a prominent breeder on the assurances that it was normal/normal only to have cin opaline hens pop out after 3 years of normal to normal breeding so evidently it was not normal/normal in the first place. But using strong normal hens as outcrosses would probably be the way to go.

 

GB's chicks are all opaline as the pairing was opaline/lw x opaline, but she is very lucky in that the wing markings of these chicks are lovely and distinct as well as not showing any evidence of a thumb print. So she's starting off from a good basis.

 

GB I know you are having some issues identifying opaline lacewings from normals so I thought I would show everyone what to look for as it can be confusing especially in diluted varieties. So here goes in both white and yellow!

 

okay here are 2 white lacewing hens, the first in opaline the second in normal. You can see much more distinct shell markings on the neck and cheeks on the normal lacewing than the opaline lacewing. In this case the mantle of the opaline lacewing has heavy markings but you can see that they are different to the regaular shell markings of the normal. Also the wing markings would not be much of a help but viewed together you can see some difference.

 

Whenever you might be in doubt of a bird being opaline or not the main tail feathers is the place to look every time! In opaline you will see a clear "colour flash" running up the centre of the tail. In the case of lacewings it's the same as their ground colour so white lacewings will have a white colour flash on the tail feathers and yellows will have yellow. It is more prominent at the base of the feather close to the body so spread out the tail coverts and have a look. In comparison the normal will have a reasonably even shade of cinnamon along it's full length. Again in these pics opaline on the left and normal on the right.

 

 

Mantles are not always a great indicator with todays heavily marked opalines BUT you can clearly see the difference between the shell markings on the back of the head and the difference in the evenness of the mantle markings.

 

 

So now all the above but in yellow. You can see that THIS opaline lacewing shows that nasty thumb print that Dean was talking about. The main this to look at is the regular shell markings in the normal and the lack of defined markings in the opaline around the head, cheeks and mantle.

 

 

This opaline has a nice clear mantle.

 

Note the colour flash down the centre of the main tail feathers in the opaline and the plain cinnamon of the normal.

Edited July 15, 201014 yr by nubbly5

Excellent post nubbly :hap: I know exactly what you mean about having to 'breed out' certain unwanted mutations in a variety. In my post showing some new birds I got, I have a really nice cinnamon opaline cobalt cock. Now I dont want cinnamon at all, and Im trying to limit opalines in my aviary but I visited so many aviaries and the quality of the blues for sale was just not there so i went with the BIRD i want in spite of the mutations. I plan to breed him to a good hen, and put his best son and best daughter/s to normal partners. I MAY need to pair a grandaughter back to him later but we'll see. With luck I should be able to pass on his look and breed out the cinnamon and/or opaline.

 

As far as shows go, it doesnt matter - I can enter his best offspring into whatever class they fall into. But for my own longterm plans... *Sigh* its got to be bred out slowly...

very nice lacewing's

Thanks for that post nubbly, fantastic. Really shows the difference between the LW and Op LW and beautifully illustrates how the normal LW can have the better markings. Nice birds by the way.

great post nubbly !!!!

Thanks Nubbly that's great info. Perfectly illustrated....I was going to start breeding lacewings this year as I bought a split cock but have changed my ind and sold him. Have enough trouble focusing on what i have now.

BUT still have my lutino cock and clearbody

yep very good post thank you

ive been not to well so excuse my none input

 

my birds as nubbly said come from good breeding and i knew this,so.. i looked for the darkest best marked Opaline hen i could find to put with this boy

as last time i put him to a white Opaline lacewing hen and all i got was thumb print wings very lightly marked

i sold the chick it was so bad

i also culled the mother

 

i knew he had nice Opaline genetics as his daughters came out perfect

so knew it was mums trate as the two lacewing chicks were boys

 

and this time as i amused would happen the gals got dads great treat and the cinnamon was deeped by the pairing of the two normal wings

the mothers nice opalineing was passed on to the cock also from this clutch

i will get pics of these three chicks soon (the light green opalines from clutch)

 

dean he was the father the fosters were a spangle and a grey / ino

 

 

i do want to breed normals but i also wanted the challenge of breeding beautiful lacewing op with out the thumb print that most hold

its why i decided to breed show birds to try and better their quality of variety as well as the overall bird

this will take time but with what i was taught when young im feeling its paying off

oh oh oh bad bad news

my newest lacewing chick the first chick ever to my gg bird

it was dead this morning their is one more chick in this nest of theirs but i really have no clue as to what one unless it comes out a spangle

so although im really wanting a norm from these guys im praying for a spangle now