Hi I have a few questions regarding budgie genetics and mutations.

 

1. How many mutations can a bird have? Is their a limit? I've seen skyblue opaline spangles before, is it possible to get a blue opaline cinnamon spangle yellowface dominant pied?

Their are alot of genes their Im wondering where it stops at? Is their a limit to how many mutations can be visible on a budgie?

 

2. Can a lutino be a spangle and a dominant pied but they are just not visible? Spo its masking it?

Can a lutino mask 2 dominant genes at once? Same with double factor spangle, can it mask genes?

 

Any genetic questions I will post here in hope that it can help me and many others. Simplest explanations as possible please. Thankyou all.

Edited April 13, 200916 yr by Pearce

I have a lutino hen that is masking yellow face, spangle, dominant pied and opaline

 

I've heard of a budgie having 7 mutations but when they have a lot it is difficult to detect some of them.

okay Thankyou very much Neville. So their is no factor limiting the amount of mutations a bird has? Whether its in split form or visual.

 

Thankyou very much.

The only real limiting factor is if the mutation occurs on the same allele - then only 2 genes can be present. Example of this is the greywing, clearwing, dilute progression a bird cannot be greywing, clearwing and dilute it can only have 2 of the three mutations that occur at the same allele.

Hi I have a few questions regarding budgie genetics and mutations.

 

1. How many mutations can a bird have? Is their a limit?

A bird can have as many mutations as genes it has for making up the individual it is. The DNA sequence of the individual bird is the limiting factor. Also as nubbly5 says, there is an issue with different mutations being alleles of the same gene that limits expression.

 

I've seen skyblue opaline spangles before, is it possible to get a blue opaline cinnamon spangle yellowface dominant pied?

Yes.

Very very attractive birds especially when violet and clearwing is also added.

 

Their are alot of genes their Im wondering where it stops at?

It stops with the amount of DNA in the birds and what that DNA codes for. (Unless you are a genetic scientist and want to start cutting and pasting genes from other species into bird embryos and making your own mutations). Interesting to note that viruses add their genetic material to cells and cause mutations in the DNA in order to replicate themselves. Since DNA mutates all the time from various causes (radiation, chemicals, viruses, bacteria, nutrition, spontaneous), there are other possibilities. But the mutation only passes to offspring if the mutation is in the gametes (reproductive cells that make eggs and sperm) or early stage embryo and is inheritable and survivable. Somatic mutations in the somatic (body) cells are not usually passed on to offspring, unless there is an underlying genetic predisposition in a line of birds that causes them to have somatic mutations when triggered by a particular environmental stimulus. Environmental stimulus can be nutrition, sunlight/radiation, chemicals that can cause some genes to turn on and others to turn off. So it never really stops because nature continuously changes and adapts in response to stimulus.

 

Is their a limit to how many mutations can be visible on a budgie?

The mutations you are referring to are colour/pigmentation and pattern distribution mutations, there are so many other mutations possible determining feather size, structure and number, eye shape, beak shape etc. Colour mutations are limited by the genes available to determine the type, characteristics and distribution of pigmentation in the budgerigar, and also the structure of the feathers since this will affect our perception of colour.

Because we perceive colour through the filters of our human perception, the structure of feathers can have an effect on the how the light reflects and refracts off the birds individual pigmentation, through the feathers and back to our eyes. This can result in two birds with the same pigmentation appearing somewhat different in colour if they have different feather structure.

 

2. Can a lutino be a spangle and a dominant pied but they are just not visible? Spo its masking it?

Can a lutino mask 2 dominant genes at once? Same with double factor spangle, can it mask genes?

Yes, yes and yes, depending on what those genes are and how they interact.

 

In the case of a dominant pied spangle lutino, it can be a dominant pied or a spangle - that is to have the genes to affect it's pigment distribution, but if there is no pigmentation (ino stops melanin pigment production) present to show the pattern of distribution, well... it looks like an ino, but you could get pied and spangle babies out of such a bird if you put it with a normal. To understand the genetics, you need to be aware of what the mutations do, how they work and how they are expressed.

 

Genotype is the genetic composition.

Phenotype is the observable traits.

 

When we look at a bird, we are seeing it's phenotype.

 

Any genetic questions I will post here in hope that it can help me and many others. Simplest explanations as possible please. Thankyou all.

 

There is not much simple with genetics. Just when you think you know, nature throws you yet another curve ball.

 

What sort of budgies are you wanting to breed?

I;m just trying to learn the basics. thankyou very much Drnat a very good post. Will have to read it a few times to get my head around it.

Ino genes are a type of albinism. Albinism is where there isn't actually any pigment in the animal to depict its genotype. So for instance you could have an albino dominant pied bird. The bird is basically pied however it cannot produce any pigment in its cells and feathers to depict its pied colouring.

For instance if you have brown hair and all of a sudden your pigment producing cells stopped functioning you would have white hair, however you geneticially have brown hair, you just look like you have white hair, because your cells can't produce brown pigment any more.

 

Basically they have the genes to produce certain colours, but they just can't physically make the pigment. Their pigment production is disabled.

very interesting Sailorwolf thankyou.

Edited April 14, 200916 yr by Pearce