I have this same question on several forums, so here something to think about for you too! (Changed links to pictures!)

 

Below you can see the parents:

 

And their offspring. At least three hens were this colour.

 

And behind

First of all, the breeder of ths chick (I only own the chick, not the parents) does not colony breed and he says this chick is 110% from these parents.

 

The question is, what colour are the parents - visual/split - and what colour is the chick? So far I have worked out that the father is a light green greywing, split or visual opaline. Mother is light green also (??) opaline. Still they're both totally different shades of green. And the chick, she's olive or dark green. Which is not possible from so light coloured parents.

 

So what is it that I can't see? Violet gene? Grey? Maybe the mother is a yellow face blue, you can see a tinge of blue on her neck... Maybe she's violet or he's grey?

 

Help me! I would like to know the chicks colour as to decide to what coloured bird to mate her next year. She's now 9 months old. At least she would be split greywing. The cock I'm thinking for her is split greywing too, skyblue violet.

Edited July 22, 200816 yr by falki

So far I have worked out that the father is a light green greywing, split or visual opaline. The father, I agree is a Greywing but remember the Greywing does dilute the body so the father could actually carry a dark factor but the greywing gene is making the body color 50% lighter which is what happens with this gene, he would be split for opaline.

 

Mother is light green also (??) opaline. Still they're both totally different shades of green. And the chick, she's olive or dark green. Which is not possible from so light coloured parents. The green is different because the mother is a normal light green with no dilution from the greywing gene, the cock greywing gene is affecting the coloration of his green. Also there are different variations of light green as there is with green and olive.

 

So what is it that I can't see? Violet gene? Grey? Maybe the mother is a yellow face blue, you can see a tinge of blue on her neck... Maybe she's violet or he's grey? It can't be grey because it would be a grey green and the cheek patches would be greyish or silver, violet gene which could explain the blue suffision on her neck or she could be a Golden Face Blue which could explain that the chick a a Golden Face and the dark yellow running through the green could make the chick darker along with 1 dark factor that the father could be carrying.

 

The cock is a greywing, the hen could be split for greywing - did you get any greywing chicks?

 

These are my thoughts, not an expert, and I am sure others will come on too.

 

ADDING: Seeing those new pictures I go with this the HEN is a Golden Face II Blue and the chick is a Golden Face II and the dark yellow running is making green darker along with 1 dark factor that the father could be carrying but is not seen because of his diluation from the greywing gene. The HEN is showing the violet suffision in the neck so I also believe this chick is carrying the violet gene too his cheek patches are very dark like a violet.

Edited July 22, 200816 yr by Elly

Thank you Elly! I think I like your solution a lot, I was hoping for her to have a violet gene and also split blue

 

It's just that Golden faces here in Finland are extremely rare... But it's happened before, rare things!

 

But please, feel free to suggest anything new!

Cock is split for blue

Hen is a Goldenface II Violet Blue (so not split - can't be split if they are blue)

Chick is a Goldenface II Violet Blue (not split)

 

these are my theories

Like Elly says, the Father is Light Green Grey wing split Opaline, as you can’t get Opaline chicks from that pair if he isn’t.

Mother Opaline Golden Face type 2 [Green bleed in body] Sky Blue Violet.

Young bird Female Opaline Golden Face type 2 Violet. In second & third picture are they the same bird?

In the bottom picture the bird behind is a Female Opaline Sky-blue.

thanks Norm for throwing in the Opaline part, I was so focused on the other part of the questions

That is very, very interesting!! Yes, the opaline part I figured out myself too ;)Now do you think it would be a good idea to mate her to a skyblue violet? Golcen face is dominant, but wouldn't there be a possibility to get normal coloured chicks too? Maybe better idea would be to try and get the goldenface better and find her a normal skyblue or cobalt?If she's a golden face, you must understand I'm highly suspicious.... But really, the mothers colour is hard to explain otherwise! The breeder called her neon green! There are very few breeders in finland who know which are the colours for the birds, they're just for pets.And yes it's the same bird... But I never noticed anything stange in that yellow colour in her chest, just thought it's part of the green. But would you say she's DF violet or how else to explain the much darker colour compared to her mother? That wold make the father violet too, and he doesn't look like it. And the chick can't have two dark factors either. So what's making her colour look so dark? Maybe the father is dark green, but just looks lighter because of the greywing?(Yes, it's my Cielo behind there, she's in a breeding cage at the moment. But nothing's happened yet....)

 

A couple of more pictures, if it helps. I also have more of the mother and the father in case you need to see.

 

 

Edited July 23, 200816 yr by falki

Violet can act like a dark factor so it makes the bird look dark as if it has dark factors. This is especially so in green or golden/yellowface birds.

 

It is hard to be sure of genetics with out more offspring and breeding.

But I suspect your baby is yellowface type 2 /goldenface (for some reason people think my Arkady is not a golden face and he is way greener and yellower than that, anyhow).

However looking back at it, it is quite possible that the bird is actually a dark green darkened by violet factors as it does not seem to have more blue towards the vent. IE its colour is too even to be a golden/yellowface. Could you look at the underside of the wings and tell us if that is blue/violet or green. This will tell us whether it is a green or a yellowface type 2/ goldenface.

 

Anyhow just ignoring the yellow base and yellowface for now. I believe your baby has at least one violet factor to it. Most likely 2. Both parents possess no dark factors nor do they each possess 2 violet factors each as they are both presenting as light greens/skyblues. Thus I believe each are carrying a violet factor. The father could possibly be carrying a dark factor which is diluted by greywing as stated before and this would be more likely as then half the babies would have dark factors. If the baby's darkness was created by violet factors alone then only about 1/4 of the babies would be like that. But then individuals never follow statistics

 

Looking at father's cheek patches - they are not very violet so he probably doesn't carry it (or it is diluted by greywing gene)

 

I think that father is: Full body coloured greywing light green male split to opaline (however he could possibly be a cobalt green greywing split to opaline)

I think that mother is: yellowface type 2 opaline skyblue carrying violet

 

I think that baby is: Violet green opaline split to fullbody colour greywing

Thank you Sailorwolf.

 

Yes, that's what I explained to the parents new owner; the mother is skyblue goldenface opaline with a violet gene and the baby is lightgreen violet opaline with split goldenface and greywing. And the father is just what he looks like.

 

Finally I can explain her colour!! There will be more babies for the goldenface mom later on, maybe with another cock too (skyblue or cobalt violet...) and babies for my green baby too hopefully, with a skyblue violet split grey wing cock. So they should be having greens and blues with single and double violet factors and they would be greywings also. And also some greens and blues too, without violet. Exciting! But that's not until next spring, she's only 9 months now and her fianceé only 2 months.

The father is a greywing not a full body has a strong bright color to it and grey wings while the greywing has it coloring at 50% diluation like the bird above. http://www.gypsywillows.com/index.php?opti...r&Itemid=19

 

I still belive that the father is carrying 1 dark factor and it is being diluted by the greywing gene.

I do believe that there is 1 violet factor involved

I do believe it is a GoldenFace

 

All these three factors are what is creating the darker green

 

Click here to see pics of Different Goldenfaces http://www.gypsywillows.com/index.php?opti...r&Itemid=19 AND Yellow Face Pictures and description http://www.gypsywillows.com/index.php?opti...r&Itemid=19

Edited July 23, 200816 yr by Elly

I believe he is a full body colour greywing. His body colour is hardly diluted at all from what I can see of it. He is the same darkness as my Emmett who has no greywing at all and is a bright green.

 

It is possible he is just a greywing dark green so he appears bright green. But his sheen to me suggests full body greywing light green. Or he could be a cobalt on the lighter side and then diluted out. But his sheen looks very sky blue under that yellow. My cobalt greywing looks like a light blue but he does not carry that sort of teal/turquoise like blue on him that a skyblue does. The bird here seems to be presenting with that turquoisey/teal skyblue colour under the yeallow.

However it is hard to tell as we cannot actually see his body colour properly

Here some more pics of the cock. I'm not sure if you were talking about him, because you mentioned cobalt and such things... I don't think he's full body colour greywing.

 

 

 

In this one there's the mother too. And I'm thinking she's a yellowface mut II, not a golcenface, but how can you tell the difference, they're very similar colouring, and both affect the bodycolour.

Has anyone else noticed we are having the same discussion over colour in this thread and the one about the bird AV got me. They are almost identical in colouring!

okay I may be worng here but the bird in the bottom picture , Bottom left. That cock as Light purple patches Now I belive that , that means it is carring the cinnamon

Neat - that's becuase he is a greywing.

 

Goldface have a very strong yellow were as yellowfaces are more of a butter yellow.

The cock has not produced any cinnamon babies (females, but normal black opaline). I thought too, that the spots on his neck looked a little brown, but all the female chicks ought to have been cinnamons in that case. But I guess the case is clear; the chick's light green (or possibly dark green, but I think light) violet 1 factor opaline and split for blue yellow/goldenface and greywing. In green series birds, yellowface is always split.

 

I can show you a picture of dark green violet too, if you wish.

I'm Getting closer LOL -

Yes I agree with you MB this birds colouring is almost identical to the bird AV got you.

I agree also with Elly that it’s quite possible that the cock bird’s colour is diluted by the Greywing, but it’s a factor that’s hard to confirm, he looks like a Light Green, but if he is Diluted he could be a Dark Green genetically, also I wouldn’t be surprised if he is masking YF also as I see plenty of Blue in his Green.

The Yellow Face 2 bird has a light Cream coloured face that doesn’t come out that good in photos, but the Golden Face has more of a Buttercup Yellow colour.

A dark green violet. Isn't he just a cutie!! Not mine though...

 

 

EDIT: Hee, now that I can compare them, the colours seem quite alike... But he (the chick above) has no yellowface gene... Oh well, who knows, maybe my chick is a dark green too.

Edited July 24, 200816 yr by falki

Yes it's very hard to tell if a Green bird is carrying the Yellow Face gene, the only way of finding out for sure is to mate it to a Blue series bird.

I believe he is a full body colour greywing. His body colour is hardly diluted at all from what I can see of it. He is the same darkness as my Emmett who has no greywing at all and is a bright green.

 

It is possible he is just a greywing dark green so he appears bright green. But his sheen to me suggests full body greywing light green. Or he could be a cobalt on the lighter side and then diluted out. But his sheen looks very sky blue under that yellow. My cobalt greywing looks like a light blue but he does not carry that sort of teal/turquoise like blue on him that a skyblue does. The bird here seems to be presenting with that turquoisey/teal skyblue colour under the yeallow.

However it is hard to tell as we cannot actually see his body colour properly

 

His throat patches especially are way too light to be a full strength colored bird if he was they would be much darker in the first picture that was posted, I believe these pics were taken with a flash which is making the body brighter in the other pics but to confirm if you can take a picture of your bird in the sunlight with no flash that will help or tell us is his body a lighter or a bright color .