Finnie

For a girl, you don't look for just ANY white, you look for overall whitish. Any budgie could have a paler color around the nostril area. That's what I think yours has. He has what looks to me like a normal boy colored cere, with a little bit of paleness around the nostrils, which doesn't detract from him being a boy. NOW, if you were to say that that lighter area is REALLY white, and covers most of his cere, then I would say,"Well, then it sounds like it could be a girl." I'm trying to read between the lines here. Are you the one hand feeding them, or are you buying him from the person who is doing the hand-feeding? Oh, I see where you have said you are going to visit him, sorry. To make sure he is healthy, I guess it comes down to how much you trust the seller. Look around, see if the place is clean and the other birds look well. Ask questions. Is there any reason why you would be doubting his health? If so, then I would look elsewhere. I think it's normal for the two to huddle together. Under the lamp seems like the most comfy spot. What I can see from your photos seems good. I hope this helps.

Dave inbreeding in itself is not the cause of deformities. Deformities can be appear in complety unrelated individuals. Cause of deformities are also not necessarily genetic but can be cause through error at any point in the creation of the organisim. THANK YOU! THANK YOU, RIP for bringing this up! (And also to the rest who also addressed this.) I've been getting very tired lately of reading a lot of people saying "Oh no! Inbred! Throw the eggs away before you get a deformed chick!" (Other places than here.) When that is not how genetics works at all, but people don't understand the intricacies of cell division and DNA replication. (Not saying I do all that well, I only remember a little bit from college days.) But it sounds like we are hearing from some actual experts,here, and it is very informative. Can't wait to learn more!

okay, will do. I might run over my photo limit, though! Chick 1: Chick 2 Chick 3: Chick 4: That's 15 photos. I'm posting it now, and then I'll add the rest after someone else posts

To answer your question about your yellow/white, red-eyed bird, she is a yellowface mutant two albino, which are sometimes called "creaminos". I have one just like her in one of my nests right now, who I've been trying to think of a name for. You have given me a great idea: Popcorn.

Wow, Splat, I'm always impressed by the things you manage to accomplish by yourself. It's very encouraging to me, because there are a lot of things around here that I sometimes have to do by myself, and I don't always think I can do it. Great job!

Me too But luckily they arent sold here in Australia Yeah, I agree with you both! And I read somewhere on line when I got my first two budgies, because their cage came with one, that the mites those are meant to repel aren't even a common problem among pet birds in America. You don't need to repel something that isn't there in the first place!

I agree, here. I hope you don't feel like we are picking you apart. We are sifting through all your information, so we can help you. A lot of times it is like detective work.

Thank You so much for responding, GB ! I wasn't sure if I'd see you much anymore.

Ah, that explains why you only have one set of grandparents listed! Well, you have left off whether one or both of the grandparents are spangles. At least one of them must be, and if they both are, then your "lutino" hen may very well be a double factor spangle hen, instead. What color are her eyes? And I agree with Kaz. People think that budgies "bond" with their mate and can't be separated, but it just isn't true. They would learn to "make friends" with different birds if you split them up. More than likely these chicks will be fine, but just in case there are any underlying genetic issues, when it is their turn to breed, I would make sure their mates are unrelated. Having them in an aviary that contains nests of any kind will basically force them to breed. Are they even old enough? Good luck with it all.

We're not calling into question the trustworthiness of the breeder. It's just that so many of the diseases they have can be dormant in a host bird, and not come to light until that bird is exposed to the stress of new surroundings. The breeder's birds may be immune to something, and therefore healthy, but they could give it to your birds. It goes the other way , too, because your birds may carry something without it affecting them. But when a new bird comes in, it may be susceptible, and come down with it. The stress of moving into a new home causes a period of time when the new bird's immune system may be weaker and more susceptible than usual. There are some germs that are called opportunistic, meaning they are always present, but they only show up under stressful conditions. So no one can really claim that their birds are 100% germ free. That's why it's best to give a longer quarantine period. Some even suggest 45- 90 days.

Hi Joey, Well, it looks like I've stumbled across this first, so I get to be the first one to try to help you. Although I might get it wrong, so hopefully someone will correct me. Marshall is a normal, and even though his first picture looked cobalt to me, his other two make me think more of a mauve. So I think he is a mauve normal. And Lily looks like an olive green recessive pied. But I am a little notorious for getting my shades of green wrong, so if the others think she doesn't look olive, they are probably right. But I see that she has clear primary flight feathers, so that makes me think that maybe, just maybe, she may be a dominant pied as well. But her markings don't really look dom pied/ recessive pied combo , so I could be wrong there, too. Also, based on that last photo of her, her cere looks more like a cock, but there is too much glare for me to tell for sure. Is her cere whitish, or is it a smooth, overall pinky/purply color? They are very pretty birds.

Hello again. It's time for me to bore you some more with my conjectures about these chicks. (Of course, nobody forced you to click on this topic, LOL! ) Actually, since I took a ton of photos of the chicks, I'm planning to just put the link to where they are all at on Photobucket, to make it easier, and of course, anyone who really doesn't care won't have to go there. But I will put a couple directly on here with a few of my questions. First a kind of recap. We're not really sure what dark factor Mystery is. He looks olive, but some of the chicks look like they might have no dark factor, which would make him only a Dark green. BUT, some of the chicks also look olive, which is impossible. So my current theory is that he is a dark green with some kind of factor that really darkens it up to olive. The chicks who look olive would then have this same factor, and it's affecting them the same way as him. Then there is the greywing question. The chicks have different "darknesses" to their grey wing markings. One even looks so dark, I think he's a normal. But it's not the same as regular normals, who have really intense black markings. So I'm wondering if whatever factor is affecting the body color could also be affecting the wing markings. AND, because of the intensity of the chick's body colors, I suspect that the greywings may actually be Full Body Color greywings. And there are two who have such lighter, more yellow wings, that I wonder if they could be (poorly marked) clearwings. One expects greywings to have 50% diluted body color, more or less, so then I wonder, could that cause a dark green bird to look light green? For my first two photos, I'm going to compare chick one, who has a more yellow wing to chick 6, who has a lot more grey on his wings. Both of them have the light body color. Chick1 on left, chick 6 on right: I guess my question about them is, would you call them the same mutation? And would you call them light green, or dark green that has been washed out by the greywing? Next are the three that I think look Olive. In order, chick 3, chick 4, chick 4 again, and chick 5: I couldn't get chick 4 to pose, so that's why there is a separate front shot and back shot of him. My comments about these that I would like help with are: Chick 3 is one of the ones that I think could be a clearwing. I am prepared to be shot down on that one. Could Chick 5 be a normal, or just a very, very dark greywing? Do you think these look like olives, or like dark greens with a little something extra? (Like violet factor?) What about the expected washing out of the greywing? I just don't see it. And here is chick number two, all by himself, because there isn't anyone to compare him to. And if anybody wants to see all the photos (38 of them), so they can get a better idea, here is a link to my photobucket album: My link I mean, if anybody is actually interested and wants to see more choices of angles and lighting, etc.

Sorry, Lion, but this method is a little too simplified. But you are still right about him being a boy. And Magic Lady, he sure is a cute little thing!

I would personally be hesitant to take him from his house to yours without his owner's permission. I have heard a lot of stories of people babysitting someone's budgie, and it dies. It even happened to us in our pre-budgie days when we watched a friend's budgies. I kind of think it might have something to do with taking the budgie away from his customary environment, to a place that is strange, and food, care and schedule that throws him off. It's very caring of you to want to improve his life, and maybe since you have three weeks, you have the time to introduce some gradual changes. But more than likely, his owners will revert him back to their normal routines. However, with a new baby in the house, maybe they would be open to letting you have him permanently, if they find they have their hands fuller than they thought they would. But I wouldn't do anything drastic. Maybe do the suggestions Splat gave you, but not all on the same day. Wait and see how he takes to each new thing before doing another. (Don't forget, adding greens will change the color and consistency of his poos. )

In one of my current clutches, two hatched on the same day, and I figured, whichever one fits a leg ring first without it falling off can be called the older. Well I rung them both at the same time, so I just put the rings on random. The next day, the "older" chick had lost it's ring, so I guess I picked wrong! It's funny, but sometimes even when they're hatched on the same day, later when they feather up, there is one who will seem to be further advanced than the other.

Well, at least you have it narrowed down to either the one day or the other. I have found with most of my (very few so far) clutches, that the first 2-3 eggs hatch one on top of the other! Sometimes 2 on one day and the 3rd on the second day, other times 3 chicks on three days in a row. I think it has to do with when the hen decides to start incubating them. You know, you can use any type of small flashlight to candle, as long as it fits in the box and you can point it from behind the eggs towards you. Mine is a little one that clips on your shirt or on a book for reading in the dark, but I have repurposed it.

Excellent! Good progress.

I'm so sorry to hear that! I guess there is a chance that he will come back to try to feed his chicks, if he doesn't get lost. Have you put up flyers in the area, in case anybody finds him? You should also call all the vets nearby, and let them know to be on the lookout, in case someone comes in with a found bird, that could be yours. At the ages of your chicks, I think the mother should be okay to finish raising them alone. Do you have seed and millet in the nest box, so they can practice eating before they fledge?

Hi Jewwie, welcome to the forum! Nice to see another Midwesterner on here. Can't wait to see photos of your budgies! (Hint, hint)

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Hi! Welcome to the forum.

I was able to get some belly shots of Mystery this morning after I fed them, and he was eating, so he didn't notice me sneak up with the camera. Sorry they are blurry. No flash, but the light bulbs were shining right on him. The more I think about him being dark instead of olive, the more I think it's possible. Here are some shots of my dark green budgie, Patrick. They are different from each other, but that's probably because of Mystery's weirdness, lol

The chicks change so much each day! Number 6 went from this last night: To this tonight: Which maybe doesn't show his belly that great, but there is a big difference in how much he's feathered up in one day. I'm also thinking of the possibility that he could be a light green. There's also that opaline one up above (chick #2) that looks pretty light to me, also. So then I thought of yet another new theory, maybe Mystery is not Olive. Maybe he's really a dark green who has some factor that makes the green look olive. (But not grey factor, since we've ruled that one out.) Maybe violet or DF violet could darken the body color up that much? Could that be an explanation why his body color doesn't look washed out? I was able to get some more shots of Mystery, but he doesn't turn towards the camera, and the lighting isn't the best in that breeding cabinet. Photo with no flash: No flash, but close to the lamp: And using a flash, but with a white paper over it: This last photo with the flash lightens him up more than he is in real life, though. The middle photo seems more accurate to me.

They are adorable!

okay, I got Photobucket to work again, but I'm going to be really sorry in the morning that I'm staying up so late! Chicks 1 and 3 are like twins, they should be the same mutation, but one has a darker body color and cheek patches than the other. I wonder if the difference could be due to violet factor. Chick two is the lightest of all of them, but I still think he looks like he is a dark green? Here are the remaining three. Two are opaline, and one is not. (Maybe it should be a triplet to the twins above.) Of the two opalines, they both look kind of olive, and one has much darker wing markings than the other. I don't know if any of these differences could be attributed to violet factor. Maybe there are differences between none, one and two violet factors? Chicks 4-6: comparing the two opalines (4 & 5) No matter how I look at the evidence, I just don't see any way that there can be light, dark, and olive in this nest. That would mean Mystery wasn't olive, and Nelly wasn't sky. I am so stumped. I'm sure they are all boys, there's only one that is iffy, and really, he's not all that iffy in person. There's one that looks like normal instead of greywing, but even that is iffy, and if people said No, he's still a greywing, I would believe them, lol. My plan is to keep two of them, and when they grow up, breed them to find out if they are in fact split to cinnamon. But gee, that sure is a long time to wait! I guess I could let Mystery and Nelly go another round and hope for some girls. But after raising 6, I think Nelly might need a rest. Plus I'm guessing that Mystery is NOT split for blue, and I already have enough green chicks to sell, people seem to want blues.