Everything posted by nubbly5
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Big Blue ( Aka Kd ) And Spice
If this is a bird that Karen bought at auction then I reckon I've seen it in the flesh and it's bigger than your average bear. And the family it comes from is extremely strong and pretty buff feathered, with one of them being placed 3rd at the nats in Adelaide. I would assume the hen was not as big as Big Blue just from his breeding alone (even if it's not the one I saw in person).
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Fertility and Medication
I swing between believing that we should not medicate v's the fact that we keep birds who normally range over many kilometers in a totally unnatural semi-intensive situation. Intensively held livestock ALWAYS have more health issues just purely due to the pressure of many bacteria/proazoa etc excreted into a small confined area. Sometimes no matter HOW robust an immune system is, it just can't cope with the overload. So I'm left thinking (my theory at the moment anyways), that if we intend creating such an unnatural envirnment to hold animals in then we sometimes need to help support the health of these animals in ways natural free roaming birds don't need. Still the issue of selecting for poor fertility and health remain though...... I think this is the biggest problem we face and a hard one to combat if our main aim is to produce big fluffy show winners.
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Fertility and Medication
It's funny isn't it......... as a show breeder I will accept poor fertility and keep that single baby from a beautiful pair in the hope that it'll be a winner and breed some more winners. What we really do is select (quite strongly when you think about it) for poor fertility. Not that I'm doing anything really to change that either. I will still keep that single "special" baby and try and breed from it and give difficult breeders a couple of chances to produce something - anything. I'm of the opinion that show breeding and selecting for fertility are somewhat mutually exclusive. Same with health status as, if one of our special birds get sick we try hard to save it. Stick it in the heat box pump antibiotics into it etc etc. When they breed on, they often breed families of birds that are not as hardy. No critism of anyone here, I do exactly the same thing, but I'm really not surprised at the way it's going when you sit down and look at what the selection criteria are for our birds - feather and size is it generally. Fertility and a robust immune system can go to buggery. The ethical side of this is a completely different story and I'm not sure aboutall of that so I'll make no comment
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A Couple Of Baby Spangles
Just caught this thread Darryl and you have some stunning young birds. Just you hang onto that grey (for at least 12 months) and then make the decision. The biggest improvement in my stud came when I could keep younger birds longer before selling them off. When I sold them before 12mths old I tended to get rid of those ones that didn't look like much as babies but then "suddenly appear" in your aviary having you ask yourself "where on earth did THAT come from?". I kept seeing nice birds in other peoples aviary that turned out to be ones of my own that I had sold on as youngsters - I figured out quickly that I was selling them way too early!
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Breeding Pairs 2009
Great stuff Dave! And who was saying they felt they would never get there?! By the looks of that cin opaline and a few others you are well on your way. As far as showing is concerned so long as the bird is not an unacceptable combination of varieities or has a disqualifying fault (check your standard or the ANBC website) then you can show them. Colour and markings are judged accordingly but never prevent you from putting them in. As far as pieds themselves are concerned the standard has different requirements for the different dominant pieds so it might pay to have a read. Generally they range from a 20mm band of ground colour (Aussie Doms) to "ground colour patches may appear on any part of the body" for variagated pieds. Best bet is to grab your standard (or buy one if you have not got one) - it's the show person's bible as far as reuirements for the different classes - but remember this is the ideal and birds that don't specifically meet the ideal can still be shown. One of the things that Novices always seem to worry about is that their birds are not good enough. Then they have a go and realize that they are. Novice section is there for people starting off in showing so the standard of birds is around what starters generally have so you CAN be competitive in the grade. Looking at your birds though - I would imagine you might not be in Novice section for too long (depending on how your state deals with grade progessions though).
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G & G Breeding Season
We bred 3 babies in 2000 (we bought 30 rings late in the year....... very optimistic). First full year of breeding was 2001. But I had done what just about everyone does when they first start out - buy anything and everything. And over the next year or so I started to realize that I had to cull hard and keep a line of birds that would give me the potential to go forward not backwards. Mind you I purchased a grey spangle hen from a local petshop which, combined with one of Ces Gearings cock birds bred the foundation line for my stud (one I call superbudgie after a super hen that won me young hens champion from the novice class). The hen ended up being a Dodgey Bros bird which originally came from Len Vinci stock. Ces' original stock (or at least what I bought) came from Nigel Tonkin birds. Since then I have had a bit of luck with an old Willie Shoeman green that bred my big blue boy and has combined really well with my original lines. Then some Henry George birds which I purchased due to the excellent blow that they have but I've found it a bit hard to get that into my lines without losing the width of head (HG's often seem a bit narrow from the front). I've also been lucky to have been given a son of Ces' national grey winner after helping with a cull and a couple of really handy syndicate birds (SWBC formed a syndicate a while back run by Ces, into which we all put $100 per year to buy good birds which are then bred from and the chicks are drawn out by raffle to each synicate share owner until each member has received a baby - this has been a really good way to get access to some pretty special lines like Garry Gazzard etc without spending thousands of dollars doing so). AND I think the few birds that I've just bought from Jan McMahon (latest additions) will really add something too judging by the dominant pieds that the dilute dom pied hen has bred. My Lacewings originally come from Lynn Ray stock. She apparently had top class lacewings but had to quit them due to bird breeders lung disease. One lone cock combined with a couple of pet shop quality hens (which came out of a texas clearbody cock of Sharon House's) plus a couple of very tidy cocks from Ces' lines built up what I've got today - and I'm mighty proud of them. The fallows are Ian Hanington and Len Vinci original stock but by God they are hard going. They don't seem to thrive or breed well - particularly the Len Vinci lines....... sigh. Clearwings, which I only bought in '07, came from the partnership of Geoff O'Connor and Brian Turner. Not sure if they are still a partnership though as I saw Geoff's birds at Tassie doing reasonably well (and without the Turner in the name). So a little history on the G&G stud........ sorry went rambling off there.
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G & G Breeding Season
No Dave With time and effort and just a little bit of luck ANYONE can get birds of the standard that I have. I don't spend a vast amount on birds and have been lucky to get those one or two birds that start off a stud and then just tried to focus on the features that I think are important. Over the previous years it was feather and mask length so my pairings were for that and I sold anything that was not of good enough quality to go on with. Now it's size and I have had to really be careful not to select just for feather anymore and when I buy birds now I look at length and when I cull I will sell smaller but still good feathered birds. You CAN get there and let me tell you, I know EXACTLY how you feel. I still feel that today when I see great birds on the bench and know that I still need to work at it. When I first started I didn't think it was possible but each year you look back and see little improvements........ just keep at it.
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G & G Breeding Season
Babies update: Well we now have 53 blue rings on and I'm happy with how things are going over all. A few ups and downs but the results are pretty good and the quality seems to be there. Some updated pics for everyone who wants to see how they are progressing (and Fran the German Shepherd will be waiting for you anyway you've got some pretty tidy babies of your own there, you don't need mine.). The cobalt boy is in the nappy cage as of Saturday and doing well along with his nest buddies - a cinnamon olive spangle, an olive clearwing and a lacewing. Some other babies are also looking pretty decent. The yellow faces are looking better feathered than I expected, although I should have thought that the cock (a blue/lacewing) might throw some of the feather my lacewing lines are now showing. There are also 2x skyblues, 1x cinn YF grey (a nice bird too) and 1x white lacewing from this nest. And I have also bred one YF white lacewing from a different nest which is looking like it might be a nice bird too. A bit of a shock (well I suppose they shouldn't be a surprise either considering the breeding behind both the mother AND the father line) are the domi pied babies. Not only was it really cute seeing the pied markings coming out in the babies, they are gorgeous - especially one cinnamon pied (completely blowing my normal/normal line out of the water mind you) which is a stonker. Sorry Kaz you can't have them even though I'm not officially breeding pieds, I'm gonna keep these!!! Another nice looking bird is a single chick from a Gary Armstrong DF hen x Dark Green Opaline Spangle cock (grandson of Ces Nationals grey winner). Although she could only manage to hatch out one chick (she addled the others and is quite an erratic hen), it might make up for it by being really very nice. It also has great spangle markings for an opaline, something Gary has been working on in his stud. One last high potential baby (will show others later) is a normal grey bred from a beautiful grey bird of mine with a hen I bred from the son of Ces' nats grey winner. These are 2 birds I really like so I am pleased that they have hatched 2 chicks one of which, so far, is magnificent and the other is maybe not quite as big but is quite a bit younger. Here is the normal grey and the mother and father below (dad looking a little grotty from feeding babies). Well that's it for now. Will update more as more babies fledge.
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Violet
Jen If she produces mauves babies with a cobalt father then she HAS to be cobalt. Quite possible that she is greywing and the greywing is modifying body colour OR she could be one of those lighter coloured cobalts. Good call with mating her with a greywing to find out if she is in fact a greywing herself. Sort of looks like it from the close up pics of her wing.
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Its Here My Very First Lacewing
Great stuff GB and nice to know the cock bird is filling eggs for you. Fingers crossed for non-spangle lacewing.
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Blue Birds
I sort of agree too. AND it does seem, just from sitting back and watching, that most will give an opinion of violet sky well before they give an opinion of a normal cobalt. I did notice that personally and had the same thought as macka. But then I'm no expert on violets so I'll keep mum on actually diagnosing one :rofl:
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Violet
Skys and cobalts CANNOT produce mauve - it's a genetic impossibility. Mauves are double dark factor so to be mauve a chick must get one dark factor from mum and one dark factor from dad. As the mum is a sky she has NO dark factors to donate so the only possible outcomes would be skys and cobalts. Also they cannot produce grey. Grey is a dominant factor and must be present in the parents for any of the chicks to be grey (unless you have the thought to be extinct recessive grey). So my bet is that either the hen is actually a cobalt but looks diluted due to the greywing OR the chicks are not mauve.
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Greywings
:sadsorry: this is one BEAUTIFUL greywing. Actually a beautiful bird even without the greywing portion. You must be happy!
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Another Quiz
I LOVE you guys!!!! Nice to see you about Fran71 (and John of course). I hope you enjoyed this little challenge. So okay now I think it's time for me to go through the results as I saw them (and that's not to say that I'm right also). Clearwing Olive Cock - split for dilute, possibly carrying violet Normal Dilute Blue Hen - double factor YF, possibly carrying violet okay, going on the current theory that YF is NOT masked by green but that green in fact gives you a split for YF AND that ALL blue chicks show YF the assumption is made that the hen MUST be double factor YF2 which shows as a normal white face. IF the cock was split for YF2 then you would have to assume that all the blue chicks would actually show as white faces as they would get one YF2 gene from mum and one YF2 gene from dad. The only other option would be one YF2 gene from mum and one green gene from dad presenting as a green split for YF2. And THIS is where I've cocked it up and I'll tell you why.......... my assumption was that the prominent YF in Australia is the YF2 AND I know of people who have white faced double factor YF birds that breed only YF's so my assumption (being now so very obviously wrong) was that it was the YF2 in double factor that produces a white faced bird. So I need to change the chicks to YF1 AND we in Australia need to undersatnd that it might well be YF1 that is more prominent than YF2. At least one of the parents is carrying violet. Dean is absolutley correct that violet could remain undetected in both olive birds AND dilute birds so it may be impossible to determine which parent is carrying violet without further test mating to known non-violet partners. Also yes Dean (violet I assumed would be visual violet so cobalt and violet). So mum would be skyblue considering all chick have single dark factor. YF2 Violet Clearwing Hen - split for dilute. Dad donates clearwing gene mum only has dilute genes to donate in this series. YF2 Blue Dilute Cock - possibly carrying violet. Dark Green Clearwing Hen - split for dilute. YF2 Cobalt Clearwing Hen - split for dilute. Anyway, that's it for my little quizzes for a bit.
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What Colour Is This Baby Budgie?
This explains cross over better than I can. http://www.budgerigars.co.uk/genetics/ques...question14.html
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What Colour Is This Baby Budgie?
If it turns out he is split for cinnamon and ino then yes there is a small chance of crossover (only a small percent chance though). It's the cinnamon/ino that is the lacewing not the opaline/ino. So in theory for the male to be lacewing he needs to be Xcin/ino Xcin/ino and at the moment he MAY be Xcin Xino one of these genes nees to cross over onto the same gene strand and then they sort of travel together, acting like a single variety rather than the combination of 2 different varieties. You would then only see the cross over in the first generation if it occurred in a hen chick so you would get Xcin/ino Y. You are much better off to start with an actual lacewing rather than a split cin split ino if you want reasonable chances of actually getting a visual lacewing.
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Another Quiz
Pretty close there GB. You can have another go at it if you want and maybe some other people would like to have a bash too. If anyone else who is reading this and LIKES these little quizzes, if you don't have a go and it turns out that there are just 2 or 3 of us doing them then there is little point posting up other quizzes. So if you want to see us keep posting little challenges like this then at least have something of a bash at it - even if it means you have to grab that old budgie genetics book out or do a bit of web referencing. Personally I love these sorts of little challenges so i thought maybe others would like them too - thanks to renee and GB who had a bash. I'll post up results in a couple of days.
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What Colour Is This Baby Budgie?
Give it a bit more time and we'llbe able to tell from later pics. Sorry to have not been of more help right now.
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Big Blue ( Aka Kd ) And Spice
Hey Kaz - nice pair! Is the blue one of Fran's? They look like they will compliment each other very nicely.
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What Colour Is This Baby Budgie?
Has to be yellow face not green. Looks spangle and pied as Dean says. Might be cinnamon, might be opaline too young for me.
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What Colour Is This Baby Budgie?
Too early for me to give a good answer but I'd guess it at cinnamon opaline (maybe grey green.....). But really that's a random guess. Would help with a few more days feather growth and knowing what the parents are.
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Another Quiz
Good going you guys! Anyone else what to give this a whirl.......?
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Hello
Hi and welcome! I agree with dave & libby on colours and my best guess on the sexes, with the photo's being as they are, is all females (but snowy is hard to tell due to recessive pied cere and photo quality). Male recessive pieds ceres never go blue but remain a pinky purple colour. A white cere on leo would indicate a female.
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Another Quiz
okay another little quiz. Don't be scared, just have a go at it. Tell me what the parents and chicks could be split for or masking. Parents: Clearwing Olive Cock Normal Dilute Blue Hen YF2 Violet Clearwing Hen YF2 Blue Dilute Cock Dark Green Clearwing Hen YF2 Cobalt Clearwing Hen
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Babies I Bred In 2009
Wow some nice birds there Shannon! Some great looking dark factors in both green and blue.