I am the same Ino that rotten little bug catches me off guard all the time, forever trying to get rid of it, Thanks Kaz lol

For breeders that are interested in Avian Genetics, one site to go to is aviangenetics.com

When i pressed on Basic Genetics and then on Genetic Myths, what did i read, well i'll leave it up to you to read.

I would like to here your thoughts.

 

Makes perfect sense and the author is on the money. The only time where there may be an issue is when a mutation is linked through it's proximity on the chromosome to a lethal recessive defect. Only a hypothesesis, and it still means that the authors statements are correct with reference to the fact that colour mutations in themselves are not lethal.

 

Interesting site.

 

Cheers

 

PT

I am the same Ino that rotten little bug catches me off guard all the time, forever trying to get rid of it, Thanks Kaz lol

 

I am so glad it wasn't just me

 

I'm pretty used to it now but at first I kept thinking it was on my monitor not IN my monitor LOL

 

For breeders that are interested in Avian Genetics, one site to go to is aviangenetics.com

When i pressed on Basic Genetics and then on Genetic Myths, what did i read, well i'll leave it up to you to read.

I would like to here your thoughts.

 

I've had a short look around

 

The Myth page - Not so much correct - of course this is mainly in cockatiels*but i took it as they were referring to all birds not a specif one * BUT it is TRUE if you breed visually same mutations in a cockatiel you do end up with Smaller birds,some have health issues as well, if you breed two visual Lutinos together You get the notorious "lutino bald spot" NO show person or good breeder wants on their Lutino cockatiel and that Lutino bald spot Can get very large and they (reputable cockatiel breeders) have worked hard to get it out of the lutino's but other breeders who don't research have put it back in

 

 

then i clicked on the mutation page

 

They have Lutino being marked as a SEX LINKED RECESSIVE GENE in budgies Yes it is sex linked NO it is not recessive it does NOT take 2 INO budgies to make an Ino budgie same with Opaline and Pearl (For cockatiels)

 

they also label a white face lutino cockatiel as an ALBINO there is no such thing as an ALBINO cockatiel - Cockatiels do not have the blue mutation that makes up the Albino an "Albino" cockatiel is just a WHITE FACE LUTINO

 

 

and there are such things as Lethal mutations

 

some consider the Crested budgie to be one

Edited April 25, 201114 yr by K&M Breeding

then i clicked on the mutation page

 

They have Lutino being marked as a SEX LINKED RECESSIVE GENE in budgies Yes it is sex linked NO it is not recessive it does NOT take 2 INO budgies to make an Ino budgie same with Opaline and Pearl (For cockatiels)

Some describe the sex linked mutations as recessive and a few describe them as dominant. When you consider a cock needs the gene to be present on both sex chromosomes to display the mutation, then I guess I will go with the recessive view.

 

 

and there are such things as Lethal mutations

 

some consider the Crested budgie to be one

 

If crest was a lethat gene, why aren't they all dead? I have also heard it referred to as a lethal gene, but from what I have seen and have been told, they are proliific breeders. Again another hypothesis, but maybe when the mutation appeared it was loosely linked with a lethal gene? Over time this link has been broken through selection (the selection bit is easy if the lethal gene is present) and now it is not an issue.

 

Happy to hear contrary views.

 

Cheers

 

PT

 

Sorry, hope you can follow this - the quotey thingy didn't work

Edited April 25, 201114 yr by **KAZ**
fixed the "quotey thing"

Hi Splat,

I have been looking for a site that will help you out, the best one i have found to date is www.accelgen.com/Genomics.aspx

Go down the page to Genomics... Another Way To View It.

Edited April 25, 201114 yr by Ino

I am the same Ino that rotten little bug catches me off guard all the time, forever trying to get rid of it, Thanks Kaz lol

 

I am so glad it wasn't just me

 

I'm pretty used to it now but at first I kept thinking it was on my monitor not IN my monitor LOL

 

For breeders that are interested in Avian Genetics, one site to go to is aviangenetics.com

When i pressed on Basic Genetics and then on Genetic Myths, what did i read, well i'll leave it up to you to read.

I would like to here your thoughts.

 

I've had a short look around

 

The Myth page - Not so much correct - of course this is mainly in cockatiels*but i took it as they were referring to all birds not a specif one * BUT it is TRUE if you breed visually same mutations in a cockatiel you do end up with Smaller birds,some have health issues as well, if you breed two visual Lutinos together You get the notorious "lutino bald spot" NO show person or good breeder wants on their Lutino cockatiel and that Lutino bald spot Can get very large and they (reputable cockatiel breeders) have worked hard to get it out of the lutino's but other breeders who don't research have put it back in

 

If you wish to apply the logic of breeding the same cockatiel mutations together which according to your un-scientific point of view then you must apply the same logic to any bird. It is pure an simple a myth at it's basic form. There have been mutations that are linked to various other mutations. Over time such linkages usually become unlinked. Size is controlled by many genes.

 

The so called bald spot is controlled like any other trait. It is true that it occurs in Lutino cockatiels. If two Lutinos are carrying this trait then yes they can produce birds with it but it is not a reason not to pair two Lutinos together. As long as you keep adequate records and know what you are doing then this trait will surface only occasionally.

 

then i clicked on the mutation page

 

They have Lutino being marked as a SEX LINKED RECESSIVE GENE in budgies Yes it is sex linked NO it is not recessive it does NOT take 2 INO budgies to make an Ino budgie same with Opaline and Pearl (For cockatiels)

 

Ino is a recessive mutation and the allele is found on the sex chromosomes so it is a sex-linked recessive gene.

 

they also label a white face lutino cockatiel as an ALBINO there is no such thing as an ALBINO cockatiel - Cockatiels do not have the blue mutation that makes up the Albino an "Albino" cockatiel is just a WHITE FACE LUTINO

 

There most certainly is such a thing as an Albino cockatiel but is generally referred too as a Whitefaced Lutino. The Blue mutation is responsible for removing yellow family pigments and in combination with the Ino gene produces a Blue mutant. FYI there is also a Yellowface Mutant in cockatiels.

 

 

and there are such things as Lethal mutations

 

some consider the Crested budgie to be one

 

The myth of a lethal gene in crested has been around since the mutation occured. I have never found any evidence to support this way of thinking. I do wonder however if the fanciers of the day thought there may be due to the lethal gene in Canaries when pairing crested birds together. Just as happens today it only takes one person of some influence to begin a myth and before you know it, the myth has taken on a life of it's own.

Hi Splat,

I have been looking for a site that will help you out, the best one i have found to date is www.accelgen.com/Genomics.aspx

Go down the page to Genomics... Another Way To View It.

 

Thank Merv, but it still gives me a headache.

But that colour guide is good, and thought it would work like that but is is saying you can work out what the young will get or not. I think we need to have a chat about this over a cuppa. LOL whens a good time.

Maybe it will click verbally.

Hey wait a minute you are meant to visit me, I will have a cuppa and cake waiting.

Good to hear to from you all.

Sorry, I was not having a go at you RIP.

I just wrote what i read in the HOLSTEIN JOURNAL by Dr Jennie Pryce and Dr Ben Hayes of Victoria's DPI.

I did not thick you could get a outcross from a brother and sister mating either.

 

Sorry if my reply made it sound like I was a bit angy as I was not. Just straightening a myth.

 

Glad you have posted such a topic of discussion. I am enjoying it even I am busy at the moment so cannot have as much input as I would like.

 

I would say though as far genomics is concerned, it really is a great tool within industries were the genome has been sequenced such as cattle, horses and chickens. These are industries worths millions of dollars, so to maximise the potential of the products make perfect sense.

my views may be "un scientific" BUT when it comes to cockatiels I've had Very long discussions with a Fantastic breeder of cockatiels and she's bred them alone for over 20 years

 

so I'll take her comments on the proper ways to breed cockatiels to get big healthy birds and Lutinos with out the bald spots Over Almost any one else

 

and no there no TRUE Albino BLUE is not a mutation in cockatiels

 

to get a "Albino" BOTH parents must be lutino and MUST be White face SO that is how a WHITE FACE LUTINO is Made, YES IT HAS RED EYES SO DOES A LUTINO they call it an Albino from other Albino animals like budgies, Deer, and anything else that can be a true Albino Pure white with red eyes

 

A careful note to make is the albino cockatiel. There is no such thing as an albino cockatiel. The solid white cockatiels, with red eyes, are actually the lutino (the solid yellow/white body) and the white face (the lack of a cheek spot, and the lack of any yellow or orange pigment) mutations combined together, making the bird totally and completely white (with the red eyes of the lutino).

 

http://www.tailfeathersnetwork.com/birdinformation/cockatielmutations.php

Let me start by saying there is no such thing as a "True Albino" cockatiel. What we call an albino cockatiel only has the phenotype (appearance) of an albino (all white feathers, pink feet, red eyes and no cheek patch). The reason it appears this way is that it is really a combination of the sex-linked Lutino mutation and the autosomal recessive Whiteface mutation. Lutino is a mutation which has affected the melanin pigment in such a way that no melanin (grey or brown coloration) is produced. Thus, a Lutino is a white or yellow bird with red eyes and an orange cheekpatch. Whiteface, however, affects the lipochrome (yellow and orange) pigment in such a way that no lipochrome is produced. Without either melanin or lipochrome, the resulting cockatiel lacks in any color and appears to be an albino. What's the difference? There's a big difference where genetic determination is concerned.

 

Genetically, the albino cockatiel is really combination mutation: Lutino-Whiteface. It is not it's own gene. The albino cockatiel cannot pass along one gene to produce another albino. Instead, one sex-linked Lutino gene and one autosomal recessive Whiteface gene are passed separately to the offspring. If a Lutino-Whiteface (Albino) male were mated to a normal hen, none of the resulting babies would be albino. Also, none of the resulting babies would be "split to albino," another misnomer. All the male offspring produced by this mating would be normal grey split to Lutino and Whiteface. The female babies would be Lutino split to whiteface. If there were a "true Albino" mutation, it would exist as a single gene, probably sex-linked, and all the female babies would look like their father.

 

 

http://www.upatsix.com/fyi/tiel_genetics.htm

 

that is just two sites that state THERE IS NO TRUE ALBINO in cockatiels

 

I'm also well aware there are yellow face cockatiels they'd be Sex linked yellow face and Dominant Yellow face

 

Do you even breed cockatiels? I know I do and I've done the proper research for it and will continue to have nice big healthy babies and Lutinos with out bald spots because I refuse to breed 2 Lutino's together so none of mine have ever had a bald spot Even if the mom has a small one the babies never have

Umm sorry to be pedantic but isn't this a budgerigar forum?

true nubbly 5 budgies not teils

 

but i got top say to k n m breeding um watch whom you be so all high in mighty with

you seem to know very little on budgies mutations and teils

sorry i have held my mouth words for ever now

however ....

do not make out that you know more than you do as clearly you do not and just as you read something does not make it true

maybe care to keep learning and maybe find a good source with actual true knowledge

to learn from

try a book named

 

a guide to , colour, mutations and genetics in parrots

by Dr Terry martin BVSc

 

 

then tell me what you think about your attitude to rips knowledge on thing

 

yes you have annoyed me to many think they know it all telling people stuff they have read rip is probably one person whom knows then double checks just incase she may be off track BEFORE STATING FACTS

 

i actually think you need to eat pie and apologize for you out right rudeness to her

This is a very interesting read.

Animals inbreed in the wild all the time.

In the animal kingdom it all seems pretty normal.

This is a very interesting read.

Animals inbreed in the wild all the time.

In the animal kingdom it all seems pretty normal.

 

Yep and nature sorts out the nuffies that result - the predators up the food chain need to eat something!

 

PT

This is a very interesting read.

Animals inbreed in the wild all the time.

In the animal kingdom it all seems pretty normal.

 

Yep and nature sorts out the nuffies that result - the predators up the food chain need to eat something!

 

PT

 

And yep we sort out our nuffies, (CULL).

As Daniel Lutolf puts it, A hobby is for making pleasure and good feelings... What a breeder.