Okay,

Dumb question #1:

 

A Dark Factor Green Cock is paired with a green Opaline Cinnamon (hen).

 

Typically in a non Dark factor pairing the recessive genes would be 25% visible in the hen, and the cock birds bred would be split for Cinnamon and for Opaline, but given the co-dominance of the Dark Factor, is it true that the cinnamon and the Opaline will dissipate / vanish in the hens, but still be split for in the cocks?

 

I have a program that tells me that the co-dominace of the dark factor overrides the recessive cinnamon and opaline (because of the position of the genes) to leave a dark factor hen that has no opaine and cinnamon?

 

Is that true or is the sotware unable to cope with true variations (I am assuming that we will always have natural variations / throwbacks fromn the norm given the presence of the recessibes?)

 

I was thinking that it would be a good way to get rid of the sex linked recessive genes etc by breeding the dark factor in to the hens?

 

Any comments appreciated.

 

regards,

 

Me

As I understand it with my limited knowledge of genetics, the hens cannot be split for a sex linked mutation i.e. opaline and cinnamon are both sex linked varieties. They either visibly show it or don't carry it at all. I doubt the dark factor has anything to do with it at all. If you had a normal cock with an opaline cinnamon hen you would get cocks split for opaline and cinnamon and normal hens.

hens cant be split for sex linked genes.

I assume by dark factor green you mean either dark green or olive.

You would get green birds from that pairing, all cocks would be split the sex linked genes. All hens would have no sex linked genes what so ever.

I agree with cranberry the dark factor of a bird doesn't mean anything with sex linked genes. You can get olive cinnamon Opaline hens. You can get dark green cinnamon hens. You can get mauve Opaline hens.

Edited May 14, 200916 yr by Pearce

Cranberry,

I agree with your comment about ...

 

the hens cannot be split for a sex linked mutation i.e. opaline and cinnamon are both sex linked varieties. They either visibly show it or don't carry it at all.

 

Cocks will obviously be split - hens are not split for sex linked genes. Typically there is a 25% chance that the hen will show the sex linked gene (75% chance she wont at all), so I agree with what you said above.

 

My post question is about the 25% of hens that should show the sex linked gene and the impacts on that 25% from a co-dominance gene (aka the Dark Factor). I am led to believe that it overrides the 25% sex linked gene.

 

I doubt the dark factor has anything to do with it at all.

 

I suspect that the co-dominance does impact. Is it the case that the Dark Factor would dominant the recessive sex linked gene so that it did not appear in those 25% of hens?

 

Obviously if this was the case then it would be a good way to remove cinnamon and opaline from breeding hens (substituting it for a dark factor which I think is the base for some nice olives and violets)

The out come of your pairing should be:

 

Cocks all split to Opaline and Cinnamon

50% will be Dark Green 50% light green

 

Hens will all be Normals

50% Dark Green, 50% light green.

 

Co-dominant

 

Co-dominat is the form of inheritance whereby both the wildtype allele and the mutant allele express themselves equally, As a result, three different phenotypes occur in this situation: the homozgous wildtype, the heterozygous phenotype and the homozygous mutant phenotype. Co-dominace can also occur between two mutant alleles in a multiple allelic series, once again producing three distinct phenotypes. In fact it is the most common form of genetic interaction between multiple alleles of loci controlling plumabge colouration. It is also known and incomplete dominance.

 

Quote from A guide to Colour Mutations & Genetics in Parrots By Dr Terry Martin BVSc

.

So you are correct as there are three equal expressions of colour. No dark factor, 1 dark factor and 2 dark factor.

 

You dark factor Green ( I assume is a Dark Green and not oliver) has 1 dark factor.

Edited May 14, 200916 yr by Daz
spelling

Here is the pair in question

 

Dark green Cock

 

Grey Green Opaline hen

 

We understand that no hen chicks will show opaline from this pairing

If the hen is a grey green you'll need to include the grey factor in the equation. Grey will mix with Green so you can get normal grey greens and dark grey greens.

Okay,

Dumb question #1:

 

A Dark Factor Green Cock is paired with a green Opaline Cinnamon (hen).

 

Typically in a non Dark factor pairing the recessive genes would be 25% visible in the hen, and the cock birds bred would be split for Cinnamon and for Opaline, but given the co-dominance of the Dark Factor, is it true that the cinnamon and the Opaline will dissipate / vanish in the hens, but still be split for in the cocks?

 

I have a program that tells me that the co-dominace of the dark factor overrides the recessive cinnamon and opaline (because of the position of the genes) to leave a dark factor hen that has no opaine and cinnamon?

 

Is that true or is the sotware unable to cope with true variations (I am assuming that we will always have natural variations / throwbacks fromn the norm given the presence of the recessibes?)

 

I was thinking that it would be a good way to get rid of the sex linked recessive genes etc by breeding the dark factor in to the hens?

 

Any comments appreciated.

 

regards,

 

Me

 

The dark factor works totally independantly of the mutations. A bird with 1 dark factor mated to a hen with no dark factor will produce 50% with 1 dark factor and 50% with no dark factor. The mutations, whether they are sex-linked, dominant or recessive will be inherited according to the rules of each individual mutation

Edited May 15, 200916 yr by Neville

Thanks everyone, helps so that I can create some Olives from the Dark Green

If paired to either another dark green or olive bird

Pairing two Dark Greens will give 25% light green, 50% dark Green and 25% Olive.

Dark factor reduces size???

Cranberry,

I agree with your comment about ...

 

the hens cannot be split for a sex linked mutation i.e. opaline and cinnamon are both sex linked varieties. They either visibly show it or don't carry it at all.

 

Cocks will obviously be split - hens are not split for sex linked genes. Typically there is a 25% chance that the hen will show the sex linked gene (75% chance she wont at all), so I agree with what you said above. Where do you get the info saying hens will have a 25% chance to show a sex linked gene? If they have the gene, they visually express it. If they dont have the gene, they dont. If a cock is visually sex linked, ALL hens he produces will be sex linked. If he is split for it 50% of his female offspring should inherit and display the same. Where does 25% come into it?

 

My post question is about the 25% of hens that should show the sex linked gene and the impacts on that 25% from a co-dominance gene (aka the Dark Factor). I am led to believe that it overrides the 25% sex linked gene. Most mutations are seperate and act seperately. One 'might' say that cinnamon can 'override' albino and produce a bird with faint brown markings when normally albino masks every other mutation (simply because it removes all pigment. The genes are expressing, but there is no VISUAL cue for us to go on because albino 'masks' the marking changes). Dark factor, grey factor and violet factor can all be on the same bird and all contribute to the overall look. They dont necessarily override eachother otherwise you would have very few composite varieties.

 

I doubt the dark factor has anything to do with it at all.

 

I suspect that the co-dominance does impact. Is it the case that the Dark Factor would dominant the recessive sex linked gene so that it did not appear in those 25% of hens? Again, dark factor can not 'push' out any other genes or suppress their expression.

 

Obviously if this was the case then it would be a good way to remove cinnamon and opaline from breeding hens (substituting it for a dark factor which I think is the base for some nice olives and violets) The best way to remove cinnamon and opaline from breeding hens is to breed them to cocks with no cinnamon or opaline, sell the males and keep the females. A female with sexlinked mutations can only pass that on to male chicks. All females will be free from the sex linked mutations unless the male is carrying them, as hens ONLY get sex linked mutations from the male parent. So breed your sex linked hens, keep their daughters and they will no longer have or pass on any undesired sex linked mutations.

 

Hope this helps some You've had some great answers already.