I'm having trouble thinking of pairs, and I don't understand grey very well yet.

 

My new YF grey cock is so handsome, but will breeding him to my violet girl stomp all over her (genetically speaking) and give me all grey babies?

 

 

As much as I would adore some little grey pieds (cute!!) I'm really keen on blues. I would absolutely adore pied greys, very much so... but I don't want to "waste" that hen's lovely colour by masking it with grey.

 

She is dom pied opaline and he is normal YF grey. What kind of babies could I expect from that pairing? What is the likelihood of them being YF also?

 

OR

 

The albino hen has such a lovely shape, and a beautiful face/mask.

 

 

Would I be better off concentrating on breeding for colour from the violet girl, and "form" (I guess you could say) by putting the grey and albino together? Would that end up being 100% grey normals? Any YF?

 

 

 

Sorry, I know I'll gradually wrap my head around this stuff. At first it's "oh, this boy is pretty and that girl is a nice colour, let's mash them together and see what happens." but now I'm starting to realise that I may not end up with my desired results.... I don't mind a few surprises, but I'd rather not go into something thinking I'll get X colour out of this pairing and find out that it's impossible to do that.

 

As I said, I'd be thrilled with a clutch of grey babies, I love them - but at the same time I don't want to let that violet hen's colour go to waste.

 

Any advice would be appreciated!

 

 

Thanks again

I'm having trouble thinking of pairs, and I don't understand grey very well yet.

 

My new YF grey cock is so handsome, but will breeding him to my violet girl stomp all over her (genetically speaking) and give me all grey babies?

 

 

As much as I would adore some little grey pieds (cute!!) I'm really keen on blues. I would absolutely adore pied greys, very much so... but I don't want to "waste" that hen's lovely colour by masking it with grey.

 

She is dom pied opaline and he is normal YF grey. What kind of babies could I expect from that pairing? What is the likelihood of them being YF also?

 

OR

 

The albino hen has such a lovely shape, and a beautiful face/mask.

 

 

Would I be better off concentrating on breeding for colour from the violet girl, and "form" (I guess you could say) by putting the grey and albino together? Would that end up being 100% grey normals? Any YF?

 

 

 

Sorry, I know I'll gradually wrap my head around this stuff. At first it's "oh, this boy is pretty and that girl is a nice colour, let's mash them together and see what happens." but now I'm starting to realise that I may not end up with my desired results.... I don't mind a few surprises, but I'd rather not go into something thinking I'll get X colour out of this pairing and find out that it's impossible to do that.

 

As I said, I'd be thrilled with a clutch of grey babies, I love them - but at the same time I don't want to let that violet hen's colour go to waste.

 

Any advice would be appreciated!

 

 

Thanks again

 

Great question!

 

From my perspective (and given that I'm only looking at photo's) I would not use the albino purely on a bird quality perspective. The Albino hen is quite a bit narrower in the head and much more pinched in at the cere so from that point the violet hen is better.

 

As for the breeding with grey. Grey is a dominant gene so a visual grey bird can have either one or two grey genes so pairing him with a violet you could get......

 

If the cock is single factor grey:

50% single factor grey

50% blue

 

If the cock is double factor grey:

100% sinlge factor grey

 

You do have the dark factor and the violet in there too so depending on what the grey is (because you can have light, medium and dark greys too) but assuming he has no dark factor and no violet:

50% chance dark factor

50% chance non dark factor

 

Of course if the grey is single dark factor and the hen is also single dark factor you will get (remember though that it's often harder to determine dark factor in greys):

25% chance double dak factor (mauve or dark grey)

50% chance of single dark factor (cobalt or medium grey)

25% chance of non dark factor (sky or light grey)

 

Exactly the same with the violet factor. So assuming that the grey bird has no violet and the hen is single factor violet.

50% chance violet factor

50% chance non violet

 

If she were double factor violet then:

100% chance for single factor violet

 

Same with the yellow face too but we know the cock is YF and the hen is not (well unless hen is double factor YF which end up as a white face but this is very unlikely).

50% chance YF

50% chance non YF

 

Hope that is clear enough........... clear as mud.

 

Oops for got the dom pied part....... Dominant gene too so your chances are:

50% dom pied

50% normal

 

AND I forgot about the opaline too...... (sigh, it's one of those mornings)

Cock is normal hen is opaline, opaline is a sex linked gene so is expressed on the X chromosone only. Hen is XY (opposite way around to mammals), Cock is XX so an oplaine hen has only one opaline gene expressed as XopY. Cock is normal but as opaline is recessive to normal he could be split for opaline (XnXop) or not (XnXn). So if he is a straight normal (not split) the breeding expectations are:

 

50% normal hens - all hens will be normal

50% normal split for opaline cocks - all cocks will be split for opaline

 

If the cock bird is split for opaline (XnXop) then the expectations are:

 

25% normal hens

25% opaline hens

25% normal split for opaline cocks

25% opaline cocks

Edited April 6, 200916 yr by nubbly5

I never fully understood the grey gene.

 

So it works likes this, grey comes out of blue in a way, so if I bred a SF grey bird witha blue bird, then 50% will be blue? That is so good to know.

I never fully understood the grey gene.

 

So it works likes this, grey comes out of blue in a way, so if I bred a SF grey bird witha blue bird, then 50% will be blue? That is so good to know.

 

Yep that's true in a way.

 

Grey gene modifies normal colours so a blue with the dominant grey gene will be grey and a green with the dominant grey gene will be grey green. They are still blue and green series birds though.

 

And yes, a single factor grey bird to a normal will breed 50% chance grey and 50% chance blue.

 

Just to complicate things though.... there WAS (maybe still is) a recessive grey gene too but it is so rare (if not extinct) that it would be safe to assume that pretty much all our grey or grey green birds have the dominant version of the grey gene.

Edited April 6, 200916 yr by nubbly5

Kaz told me about this recessive grey gene once before. This came up in the deabte about bush budgies actually.

Nubbly, you made my head explode - but that is really great stuff, thank you for taking the time to set it all out!

 

So the summary of the post would be "you might get blue, you might get violets, you might get pieds, you might get YFs, you might get opaline" That's okay, I like nice surprises.

 

And when you say pinched in at the cere, does that mean when you look at the birds straight on, you can see the eyes more easily? Which is less desirable - they're meant to look like Dumb/Dumber in Dave's signature up there, right?

 

 

 

Regarding the greys - so I can try with this pair, and if I don't get blues, there's a good chance he is DF grey, meaning he'll always give visual greys.

 

I love greys so a clutch full of them wouldn't upset me at all... but I would love blue babies. Perhaps pair her with him at first and then find a nice blue boy for her later? They are few and far between, here.

Nubbly, you made my head explode - but that is really great stuff, thank you for taking the time to set it all out!

 

So the summary of the post would be "you might get blue, you might get violets, you might get pieds, you might get YFs, you might get opaline" That's okay, I like nice surprises.

 

And when you say pinched in at the cere, does that mean when you look at the birds straight on, you can see the eyes more easily? Which is less desirable - they're meant to look like Dumb/Dumber in Dave's signature up there, right?

 

 

 

Regarding the greys - so I can try with this pair, and if I don't get blues, there's a good chance he is DF grey, meaning he'll always give visual greys.

 

I love greys so a clutch full of them wouldn't upset me at all... but I would love blue babies. Perhaps pair her with him at first and then find a nice blue boy for her later? They are few and far between, here.

 

Sorry for the head explosion!

 

In regards to the pinched in part - yes, you can see her eyes more easily and she does not have width (or directional feather) above the cere. You really want to have some feather that at least goes horizontally across the top of the cere to give that look of heavy brows. Some people call it saddle bags, others directional feather. It basically means that when you look front on to the bird you don't see what is called a "keyhole" effect where the bird looks like it comes in towards the eyes/cere and then goes out at the top again, you want width all the way up.... sorry I don't know how else to describe it. One day I'll get to and post some pics on this.

 

As far as the grey is concerned, abosolutely right. Give him a go, most likely he will be single factor grey anyway but if over a couple of rounds (with reasonable chick numbers), all he throws is grey you can assume he is DF grey. None the less he is a beautiful bird and well worth using on a lovely hen like the dom pied. AND even if he is DF grey you will know that all the chick from this pairing are single factor grey and will therefore have a good chance of throwing blue when they are paired.

 

And yes, maybe blue, maybe YF, maybe dom pied, maybe normals, etc etc. Should be an interesting pairing in quality and variety.

 

I just noticed that you don't breed for showing but from the qulaity of the birds in the pics I sort of assumed that you did! I'm really very impressed with the quality of birds you have. They would compete well in any Novice competitions over here!!!

Edited April 6, 200916 yr by nubbly5

Well - I went and got my little pet budgie Maurie as a companion.. but you guys got me hooked on all things budgies, and I thought I might like to try breeding later in the year. I think I got very lucky with the birds I've found, to get started (providing they are good breeders, I don't want to get too far ahead of myself). Taking things slowly at the moment.

 

I need to contact my local club.. at this point I don't really see myself as a "show" person, but I'd like to find out more, I wouldn't mind giving it a bash and seeing how I go

Well - I went and got my little pet budgie Maurie as a companion.. but you guys got me hooked on all things budgies, and I thought I might like to try breeding later in the year. I think I got very lucky with the birds I've found, to get started (providing they are good breeders, I don't want to get too far ahead of myself). Taking things slowly at the moment.

 

I need to contact my local club.. at this point I don't really see myself as a "show" person, but I'd like to find out more, I wouldn't mind giving it a bash and seeing how I go

 

 

Well as far as birds go, you are off on the right track. The TCB you picked up is a really tidy hen too! I give you fair warning though, breeding exhibition budgies is pretty addictive!!!!!!

I'm only in the preparation stages and I'm already addicted :/

 

Not a good sign huh?

 

It's too late for me! Save yourselves!

I'm only in the preparation stages and I'm already addicted :/

 

Not a good sign huh?

 

It's too late for me! Save yourselves!

 

Hahahahaha too late for many on this forum!!!!!

 

I started (or re-started) with 2 double breeding cabinets on the back verandah and a small prefab double aviary, graduated to a 3x3m shed as a breeding room with 2x 3x6m flights and now have a 6x12m shed purpose built with a 3x6m bird room housing 24 cabinets and 6 corner holding cages and 6x (1.5x 6m) flights (one divided in half to form a baby flight and a show team flight). But I swear I'm not additcted (Gina twitches slightly)........

You can stop anytime you like, right?

You can stop anytime you like, right?

 

Of course!

no i am only 14 and i love my birds

 

i will never stop

Edited April 6, 200916 yr by Dave_McMinn
spelling

I wish I had started early like you Shannon

it is good most, of the top breeder started early

 

so hoping i will be there one day

 

but it is all about if you love your birds

Edited April 6, 200916 yr by Dave_McMinn
spelling

You've been very lucky with petshop buys Emma. I wish I could score like that .

 

I've never been keen on grey birds but the yf greys are interesting and I simply love your dom pied. They are one of my favourites along with spangles, opalines and opaline spangles.

 

It'll be interesting to see what you get from them.

 

I've got a funny feeling that budgie addicts wouldn't have an easy time of withdrawal if one wanted to try giving up.

The yellowface grey and the violet pied look good together. If you are lucky, you might even get a yellowface violet pied chick that would look quite spectacular. Trust your own choices and your birds.

That would be a lovely surprise. I'm really looking forward to seeing what happens