I have a pair, Dominant Pied Sky Blue Hen and an Albino Cock, they had a clutch of 4 eggs, 3 hatched. I got 2 Albino Hens from it and this chick???? The body is pure white (fluffy white down feathers) the head is dark. There are not other colored pin feathers on it's entire body except 2 dark pin feathers in its "arm pit" and1 dark pin feather in its tail feathers. What mutation is this???

 

 

Personally I am going to go with a recessive pied are the eyes plum?

Or double factor pied because the albino hen could be a dominant pied too but it is masked by the ino gene, so both parents giving 1 pied gene will result in a double factor pied and I am leaning this route because there are no pied marking on the body and double factors usually display little if no wing marking usually on the head as you see and around the shoulder area which may come in as the chicks feather up.

The hen is not albino, the hen is dominat pied (possibly clearwing)... the cock is Albino. Also the eyes are not red or plum they are jet black. That being said... any other suggestions???

If the cock is an Albino, then the young cannot be a Double Factor dominant pied, as the father has to have two ino genes to show as an Ino, he cannot have one Ino gene and one dom pied gene, as he would appear as a Dom Pied split Ino.

 

Dad woud pass on an Ino gene, where Mum would pass on either a dom pied gene, or a gene taht is hidden in this case. The young are definitely pieds, either dom or recessive, they cannot be DF if Dad is an Albino, and if Dad is an Albino and they are not, then they must all be male.

 

I look forward to them feathering up

If the cock is an Albino, then the young cannot be a Double Factor dominant pied, as the father has to have two ino genes to show as an Ino, he cannot have one Ino gene and one dom pied gene, as he would appear as a Dom Pied split Ino.

 

Dad woud pass on an Ino gene, where Mum would pass on either a dom pied gene, or a gene taht is hidden in this case. The young are definitely pieds, either dom or recessive, they cannot be DF if Dad is an Albino, and if Dad is an Albino and they are not, then they must all be male.

 

I look forward to them feathering up

 

Not true Dave ino is a sex-linked gene and a dominant or recessive pied is a non-sex-linked so they lay on 2 different alleles and ino gene is only erasing the markings nothing more.

 

The cock has too XX genes both INO yes but then there are the 2 Non-Sex Linked Allele that carry Dominant pied, recessive pied, spangle etc... (another example you can have a Ino Spangle )

 

So the cock can be an Albino Dominant Pied or even a Recessive

 

Other examples there are Opaline Double Factor Dominant Pied or even a Recessive Opaline Pied these combinations are very real . Sex-linked and Non-Sex Linked genes can be combined the only thing the Ino Gene is doing is erasing all the markings of this bird no what he can carry .

 

If he is a pied he could be either an Ino Dominant Pied (Double Factor himself) or an Ino Dominant Pied split to (another recessive gene). But that means that all the babies would be dominant pied either single or double factor.

 

OR if this is a recessive pied baby he could be a Recessive he could be a Recessive himself or be split to Recessive Pied.

Edited March 4, 200916 yr by Elly

I agree with Elly, I would say DF dom pied too, should be a pretty baby!

I agree, its a DF dominant pied chick.

Ino's can have any mutation that has been hidden by the ino gene and he must be hiding Dominant pied

Ino is like cinnamon, it only changes the appearance of the dominant or recessive markings, in the dad's case.

Edited March 4, 200916 yr by **Liv**

okay, forgive me if I was wrong.

 

I was under the impression that for him to be a displaying Albino, he would need to get an Ino gene from his mother and an Ino gene from his father. I do not see how if they passed on the Ino gene, they could also pass on the dominant pied gene. Maybe I am confused on this.

 

I understand how it would work with the hen with the gene being sex-linked, but I am not sure how it would work for the boys.

think of it like cinnamon dave. Cinnamon shows on both dominant pied hens and cocks... ino is just the same

If the cock is an Albino, then the young cannot be a Double Factor dominant pied, as the father has to have two ino genes to show as an Ino, he cannot have one Ino gene and one dom pied gene, as he would appear as a Dom Pied split Ino.

 

Dad woud pass on an Ino gene, where Mum would pass on either a dom pied gene, or a gene taht is hidden in this case. The young are definitely pieds, either dom or recessive, they cannot be DF if Dad is an Albino, and if Dad is an Albino and they are not, then they must all be male.

 

I look forward to them feathering up

 

It is 2 different genes completely one gene is laying on the sex-linked gene and you are right a cock has to have 2 sex-linked genes to express this gene BUT a cock doesn't need to have 2 spangle genes to express the gene because it is not on the lay on the X chromosome like the INO gene does.

 

You have non-sex linked genes and sex-linked genes only in sex-linked genes does the cock need to have both of those genes to express the gene.

 

Then you have of course recessive and dominant genes these genes lay on the non-sex linked allele and the dominant will dominant the recessive gene (and then some of course co-dominant too like a Spangle and a Dominant Pied).

 

Does that make more sense?

The hen is not albino, the hen is dominat pied (possibly clearwing)... the cock is Albino. Also the eyes are not red or plum they are jet black. That being said... any other suggestions???

 

Sorry about that it was early, I go with Double Factor Pied then like I said above .

okay, that makes complete sense to me now.

okay, that makes complete sense to me now.

 

 

I'll go with the DF Dominant Pied. This means this chick must be a male, right?? And this also means that I've now found out that my Albino Cock is Split Domiant Pied, right?? I can't wait to see what this chick looks like. The only part that sucks is that my hen is sky blue and the cock is Albino... I got 2 albino chicks and this df dom pied chick... and it looks like this chick is going to have NO body color (will be all white with black bars on the head)... so I still don't know what dark factor the Albino cock (dad) is???? Am I right assuming this chick will have no other body color??? All the feathers coming in on it's back and wings are white... will it's belly have color as it feathers up???

 

I'm still confused a bit on this, but I think what you are saying is that you only need one Ino gene for it to be visual? Is this only if it comes from the cock?? Like my Opaline, I only needed the cock to be Opaline and I got Opaline Hen chicks... and in this case I only needed the cock to be Ino to get Ino hen chicks. So does this work that way with all sex linked genes on cocks? Do I only need that one gene from the dad to get visual chicks of that particual gene.

okay, that makes complete sense to me now.

 

I'll go with the DF Dominant Pied. This means this chick must be a male, right?? Pieds are not sex-linked so you won't know unless the experts can tell on the cere.

And this also means that I've now found out that my Albino Cock is Split Domiant Pied, right?? Not split he is a dominant pied the ino is just erasing the pied marks

so I still don't know what dark factor the Albino cock (dad) is???? right

Am I right assuming this chick will have no other body color??? All the feathers coming in on it's back and wings are white... will it's belly have color as it feathers up??? most likely

I'm still confused a bit on this, but I think what you are saying is that you only need one Ino gene for it to be visual? A male budgie has 2 xx sex chromosomes and a female budgie only has 1 (xy) that can carry the ino gene so a male does need 2 ino genes to be visual and a female only needs 1 to visual this is different completely different then a non-sex linked gene like Spangle or Dominant pied.

Is this only if it comes from the cock?? Sex-linked genes can come from both parents but only the male can not show a sex linked gene because he needs 2 to be visual a female will always be visual. So if you had 2 inos then you would have 100% inos.

Like my Opaline, I only needed the cock to be Opaline and I got Opaline Hen chicks... and in this case I only needed the cock to be Ino to get Ino hen chicks. So does this work that way with all sex linked genes on cocks? Do I only need that one gene from the dad to get visual chicks of that particual gene. Yes but they will all be females

 

I hope I got that right my head is starting to ache (not from this post just a headache coming on)

 

I'll go with the DF Dominant Pied. This means this chick must be a male, right?? And this also means that I've now found out that my Albino Cock is Split Domiant Pied, right?? I can't wait to see what this chick looks like. The only part that sucks is that my hen is sky blue and the cock is Albino... I got 2 albino chicks and this df dom pied chick... and it looks like this chick is going to have NO body color (will be all white with black bars on the head)... so I still don't know what dark factor the Albino cock (dad) is???? Am I right assuming this chick will have no other body color??? All the feathers coming in on it's back and wings are white... will it's belly have color as it feathers up???

 

I'm still confused a bit on this, but I think what you are saying is that you only need one Ino gene for it to be visual? Is this only if it comes from the cock?? Like my Opaline, I only needed the cock to be Opaline and I got Opaline Hen chicks... and in this case I only needed the cock to be Ino to get Ino hen chicks. So does this work that way with all sex linked genes on cocks? Do I only need that one gene from the dad to get visual chicks of that particual gene.

It is most likely that the chick is a double factor dominant pied. If he is then your albino cock bird is masking dominant, not split for it. Budgies can't be split for a dominant mutation

 

The ino gene works the same as other sex-linked genes. It would have to come from both parents to get male inos, but if it only comes from the male you will only get females.

Edited March 5, 200916 yr by Neville

okay, that makes complete sense to me now.

 

I'll go with the DF Dominant Pied. This means this chick must be a male, right?? Pieds are not sex-linked so you won't know unless the experts can tell on the cere. But since dad is Ino and all Inos he produced would be female, wouldn't all other chicks produced be males????

And this also means that I've now found out that my Albino Cock is Split Domiant Pied, right?? Not split he is a dominant pied the ino is just erasing the pied marks okay so he's not "split" he IS Dominant Pied, but because of the Ino I can't "see" it ... so is he Albino "Maksing" Dominant Pied or is he an Albino Dominant Pied Cock??

so I still don't know what dark factor the Albino cock (dad) is???? right

Am I right assuming this chick will have no other body color??? All the feathers coming in on it's back and wings are white... will it's belly have color as it feathers up??? most likely

I'm still confused a bit on this, but I think what you are saying is that you only need one Ino gene for it to be visual? A male budgie has 2 xx sex chromosomes and a female budgie only has 1 (xy) that can carry the ino gene so a male does need 2 ino genes to be visual and a female only needs 1 to visual this is different completely different then a non-sex linked gene like Spangle or Dominant pied. So to get a male Albino chick do you need one gene from each parent, so that means that my Albino Cock's mother was Albio and his father was split Albino???

Is this only if it comes from the cock?? Sex-linked genes can come from both parents but only the male can not show a sex linked gene because he needs 2 to be visual a female will always be visual. So if you had 2 inos then you would have 100% inos. Does a visual male Albino carry the Ino gene on only one of it's xx or is there an ino gene attached to each one? If so why can't an Albino male pass both Ino genes from each xx to a chick and produce a male albino chick? We get all Albino hens because dad is the only one passing on the ino gene? So we can only get a male Albino chick if mom was Albino and dad was at least carrying the gene on one xx???

Like my Opaline, I only needed the cock to be Opaline and I got Opaline Hen chicks... and in this case I only needed the cock to be Ino to get Ino hen chicks. So does this work that way with all sex linked genes on cocks? Do I only need that one gene from the dad to get visual chicks of that particual gene. Yes but they will all be females Yes, both my Opaline chicks and both the Albino chicks I'm told are female, they have to be because the fathers are visually showing the gene and the mothers aren't??

 

I hope I got that right my head is starting to ache (not from this post just a headache coming on)

 

I have a pair, Dominant Pied Sky Blue Hen and an Albino Cock, they had a clutch of 4 eggs, 3 hatched. I got 2 Albino Hens from it and this chick???? The body is pure white (fluffy white down feathers) the head is dark. There are not other colored pin feathers on it's entire body except 2 dark pin feathers in its "arm pit" and1 dark pin feather in its tail feathers. What mutation is this???

 

 

 

Looks like a hen to me

But you seem to have used a flash

Edited March 5, 200916 yr by KAZ

I'll go with the DF Dominant Pied. This means this chick must be a male, right?? And this also means that I've now found out that my Albino Cock is Split Domiant Pied, right?? I can't wait to see what this chick looks like. The only part that sucks is that my hen is sky blue and the cock is Albino... I got 2 albino chicks and this df dom pied chick... and it looks like this chick is going to have NO body color (will be all white with black bars on the head)... so I still don't know what dark factor the Albino cock (dad) is???? Am I right assuming this chick will have no other body color??? All the feathers coming in on it's back and wings are white... will it's belly have color as it feathers up???I'm still confused a bit on this, but I think what you are saying is that you only need one Ino gene for it to be visual? Is this only if it comes from the cock?? Like my Opaline, I only needed the cock to be Opaline and I got Opaline Hen chicks... and in this case I only needed the cock to be Ino to get Ino hen chicks. So does this work that way with all sex linked genes on cocks? Do I only need that one gene from the dad to get visual chicks of that particual gene.

It is most likely that the chick is a double factor dominant pied. If he is then your albino cock bird is masking dominant, not split for it. Budgies can't be split for a dominant mutation The ino gene works the same as other sex-linked genes. It would have to come from both parents to get male inos, but if it only comes from the male you will only get females.

Thank you Neville, you answered one of the questions I was hoping to find out. Male Inos need a gene from each parent, female Inos only need one from dad. Thank you. So I take it, it's not possible for dad to pass two Ino genes himself even though he has 2 x that ino gene can attach to??

I have a pair, Dominant Pied Sky Blue Hen and an Albino Cock, they had a clutch of 4 eggs, 3 hatched. I got 2 Albino Hens from it and this chick???? The body is pure white (fluffy white down feathers) the head is dark. There are not other colored pin feathers on it's entire body except 2 dark pin feathers in its "arm pit" and1 dark pin feather in its tail feathers. What mutation is this???

 

Looks like a hen to me But you seem to have used a flash

Yes, shame on me again.. I used the flash because it has been nothing but cloudy and dreary here and my light bulbs don't help either. I will try to get new pics without a flash and as it feathers up more. I thought it HAD to be a male since dad was Albino all Albino chicks would be female and all other chicks would be male but if he is an Albino Dominant Pied I guess I was wrong?? Did I say that right? Is he an Albino Dominant Pied Cock or is he just Albino Masking Dominant Pied Cock? Oh and one more question... if this chick is a DF Dominant Pied chick would it be split Ino because dad is Ino or can't it be split for this gene??

Edited March 5, 200916 yr by chrissy0705

No nev is right, the chick has to be a male. It will be a DF dominant pied that is split for albino.

 

In regards to the father, males DO need 1 sex linked gene from both parents to be visual for sex linked mutations. So a quick punnet square for these parents would be (using X as albino, x as normal - dad would be XX, mom would be xY since females carry the Y chromosome and only one x):

 

Dad XX - Mom xY:

 

x Y

 

X xX XY

 

X xX XY

 

Meaning all females from this pair will be XY (albino) and all males from this pair will be xX (normal split for albino). So for this chick to show any colouration, it can ONLY be a male (even though it is double factor dominant pied).

Edited March 5, 200916 yr by Dean_NZ

adree with all that DF dom pied matches for the chick and as Neville pointed out it will be male as all hens from this pairing will be INO (and these hens could be dom pied as well just having the gene masked by the INO gene)

Neville, thank you, like I said my head was a pounding and I totally forgot that all the hens would be ino's good thing we all make a good team to figure it all out.

Just wondering if this chicks is showing signs of Sky Blue does this mean that the dad's color is sky blue? Mom is sky blue dad is albino and since the chicks is turning out to be sky blue...? Or does that not mean anything?

the dad could be cobalt or skyblue as that can give sky blue and or sky chicks depending if the dark factor gene is past on

the dad could be cobalt or skyblue as that can give sky blue and or sky chicks depending if the dark factor gene is past on

 

 

okay so a sky baby and a sky mom means dad can be sky or cobalt?

If I get a cobalt baby next time does that mean dad would have to be mauve or could he still be cobalt?

 

I guess what I'm asking is what color chick(s) would I have to get from this pair to figure out what dad's dark factor is?

I know a sky and mauve make cobalts.

I know a sky and a cobalt make skys and cobalts

I know two skys make skys, etc...

 

But so far I have albinos and a sky from albino and sky parents.

okay so a sky baby and a sky mom means dad can be sky or cobalt? he could be either but not mauve

If I get a cobalt baby next time does that mean dad would have to be mauve or could he still be cobalt? he could still be just cobalt

 

if he was a sky blue (no dark factors) you would ONLY get sky blue chicks - when matched to skyblue hen

If he was cobalt (one dark factor) you could get both sky and cobalt chicks - when matched to a sky blue hen

if he was mauve (two dark factors) you would ONLY get cobalt chicks - when matched to a sky blue hen

 

too check you could next breed him to a mauve as the above would be reverse:

 

skyblue - only cobalt chicks

cobalt - both cobalt and mauves chicks

mauve - only mauve chicks

Edited March 11, 200916 yr by *Nerwen*