nubbly5

He is a pretty nice example of a show budgie. Pairing him with another spangle will produce some double factor spangles, some spangles and some normals. Maybe because he is opaline spangle aiming for double factors is better. Adding cinnamon and oplaine into a double factor spangle line reduces the suffusion that can sometimes crop up in DF spangles. I would look for a hen with a good depth of mask.

Hey splat - you might be getting bad suffusion in your DF spangles but the dark factor on the normal spangles is lovely. Got a question though....... the light green spangle cock - how come there are yellow feathers through the body colour? Or is that just a random thing?

See we do read your posts

Yay for Darryl - I'll go along with him.

Hmmm yep GB - I didn't continue due to the questions I had re double factor dom pied and the 1 factor. I've added my thoughts below. double factor dominant pied cinnamon Opaline 1 factor sky violet hen - split rec pied and gf cobalt blue spangle cock - split rec pied, opaline, cinnamon and masking YF2 out come chicks are yf2 cobalt spangle rececive pie cock - split opaline and cinnamon, must be a combo pied (rec pied/dom pied) gf sf violet cinnamon dominant pie cock - split opaline, 50% chance of split rec pied, 50% chance masking YF2 Opaline dominant pied hen - 50% chance split rec pied Dom pied sky 1 factor violet hen - 50% chance split rec pied opaline cobalt rececive pied cock - this must be a combo pied (rec pied/dom pied combo), split cinnamon

Hey GB can you please clarify what this means? I don't quite understand the 1 factor - do you mean single factor violet? And just one other thing -ummmm please correct me if I'm wrong but all chicks from a double factor dom pied are going to be dom pied regardless. Even if they are a combo dom pied/rec pied they are still going to be pied and not normals.

Gee even I could get into dommie pieds if you sent me THOSE ones!

Yeah guys - sorry about the change but when I put it together I was thinking cinnamon and then added ino for some interest - completely missing that a cinnamon-ino hen would have to be lacewing. Preety poor for a lacewing breeder if I do say so myself. Hence the change to opaline. Thankfully RIP hinted at the error enough to prompt me to figure out what I'd done okay looks like the answers are out there. Thanks to everyone that had a go, no need to be scared to have a bash (as you saw the test setter cocked it up right from the start anyway ). I'll try and explain the results somewhat. Parents: Normal Cobalt Cock - visually we know that he has one dark factor (cobalt) and that he is blue. Lutino Hen - visually we know she is ino. Babies: Lutino hen - She must be split for blue (she will get one blue gene from dad). She will have 25% chance of no dark factor (light green), 50% chance of single dark factor (dark green), 25% chance of double dark factor (olive) depending on which genes are donated by which parent (because we know that we have both a non dark factor (skyblue hen) AND a double dark factor (Opaline Olive Cock) we know that both parents MUST be single dark factor. She will also have a 50% chance of masking opaline because in sex linked variety hens the X gene on which the trait travels is donated by the father (in the case of a hen chick). Because there is an oplaine in the nest we know he MUST be split for opaline so in the case of this hen she could have recieved the normal gene OR the opaline gene from her father. Because of she is lutino we also know that the father must be split for ino. Albino cock - To get an ino cock you need an ino hen and at least a split ino cock so another reason to prove the father is split for ino. Because we know there is an oplaine in the nest as well this means that the mother has to be opaline and therefore this chick being a cock bird (2 X genes) recieves one X gene from mother (the only one she has to donate) and one from his father (who has 2 X genes to donate) so therefore this chick has 50% chance of being opaline and 50% chance of being split opaline. This guy lets you know that the mother is split for blue. Opaline olive cock - this boy lets you know that both father AND mother must be at least single dark factor birds (but it doesn't tell you if the hen is double dark factor or not) and that mother HAS to be masking opaline. He is also split for blue as his father is blue. He is split for ino from his mother. Normal Skyblue hen - this girl gives away that the mother must be single dark factor as she will have had to inherit 2 non dark factor genes, one from mum and one from dad - we know dad has one non dark factor so now we know mum has one non dark factor gene too. Hope that is not too confusing. Anyone like to design another test/quiz thing......?

Nah have a go Dean - seems I scared everyone off anyway. Maybe you can prompt some more action.......

Now THAT'S what I'm after. I thought the cobalt baby was going to turn out pretty well - definitely seems that way. I really like it when I see this sort of feathering - very lifted on top. A cutie violet clearwing - you can just see the colour peeping out on the pins near the tail. The white lacewing from previous posts - coming along very nicely.

Gorgeous! You have a lovely line of spangles there Splat!!!!!

I figured I would be banned from making early posts. I believe in people learning from figuring it out for themselves. I can point out an error if you wish me too but at this stage I will not. It can be a learning exercise also. I am away till Monday (escort job again....oh my that sounds suss don't it ). Gina I'll be in mobile range till I get to Wubin after that who knows. Cheers all and have fun. OMG and you don't sleep either Enjoy escorting all those big boys You can tell me where I've buggered up again then! (Although I think you are just a bit mean to not tell me now). okay anyone else going to give this a go? Good effort there Renee! Oooh ooh I reckon I know where I've cocked it up - Sorry Renee I've changed it a bit...... but you are on the right track there apart from one bit. Parents visually are: Normal cobalt cock Lutino hen Babies are: Lutino hen Albino cock Opaline olive cock Normal Skyblue hen So all I've changed just one outcome from Cinnamon Olive Cock to Opaline Olive Cock anyone hazzard to guess why?

okay to clarify - Cinnamon olive chick is non opaline.

Hypothetical - but you are banned from making an early answer!!!!! You are too expert in the genetics area and should let some others have a go first (too smart for the rest of us :ohmygod: ). Or are you going to point out where I muffed up again....... :camera: coz that's okay. I'd rather know that I have not got something wrong somwhere.

Parents visually are: Normal cobalt cock Lutino hen Babies are: Lutino hen Albino cock Cinnamon olive cock Normal Skyblue hen Assuming no other recessive hiddens apart from whats come out what are which parents split or masking and what could the chicks be split or masking?

Really nice GB! You have some wonderful stock birds there and a great start for the future. That grey green split lacewing has really grown on and is looking nice........ damn, maybe a sold him too early

Yep they sure do! Hey Shannon, be prepared to make this a several year project. That big violet clearwing I showed you, his babies are tragic and that was to quite a clear winged hen....... sigh. The clearwings I've bred from normal splits back to the clearest bird I could find are all quite strongly marked. I can definitely see why people say that this is one of the hardest varieties to get improvement in. Get size - Lose clarity - that just seems to be it..... Some nice birds there though. The 07 lightgreen hen has outstanding wings. Lovely colours too - one of the reasons why I love clearwings is for the pretty colours - it's so nice to have the colour flashes in the aviary in amoungst all those grey green birds

Ooops I always get Brownwing and Darkwing mixed up - insert instead any other recessive variety that fits in there.

Just like those horrible "puppy factories" this sounds very much like a "bird factory". Next time maybe find a specialized budgie breeder who can help you out with a healthy happy baby birdie.

:rofl: :rofl: As for photobucket I have no trouble at all, aint I smart You see I put all my pics in photoshop edit and resize then save then I go into photobucket go into download photos and select what ever I want, just before I select 55 pics in one go pushed download went and watched murder she wrote for 5 minutes come back in and wellar all done so easy. Sorry guys but it is easy Yar I'm with GB on that one sorry. I resize and edit with ACDC and when I try to upload just one picture, at least 50% of the time my whole system freezes (big sigh) and I have to reboot. I thought I was just being a bit impatient so went off the do something else for 1/2 hour, came back, still the same. Don't even talk about the bulk uploading system........ grrrrr. It just frustrates me to death. We run on a very dodgy satelite service coz no ADSL, no wireless etc etc and to be honest it's pretty hit and miss or in Spewbuckets case, miss and miss.

:rofl: photobucket sucks i personally call it f@$Kbucket it does my head in your baby's are so lovely keep breeding toughs lacewings i will one day need more culls lol hopefully from the same lines your pics are beautiful your time spent explaining everything in such detail is a blessing to us less knowledgeable breeders thank you Heeheehee nice one GB. Yes your name for Photobucket I use too when it's all gone pear shaped for about the gazzilionth time whilst trying to simply upload pics! Hmmmm, not sure that I'll commit to selling these ones JUST yet :rofl: Maybe a couple of those weird feathered things :rofl:

snh snh snh. I always thought super glue was a fair substitute for a crested budgerigar.

Thanks guys. I'm pleased that you like reading the thread - it makes up for all the horrible issues that goes with Photobucket (I call it Spewbucket!!!). Dean - I remember your post and at the time had seen nothing at all like it before (just what Kaz said, don't know so don't comment) other than what people talk about seeing with crest bred birds. I would love to see some more photos as your bird grows as the feather disturbance looks way more pronounced than in my birds. For me I would be really surprised if it has anything to do with crests as I have never ever had any and I would not expect my birds to have anything like crest genes anywhere near them but the fact that there have been 2 like this from the same breeding for me suggests more than just a fluke. I would bet though that my lacewing babies will end up with little to no evidence of this one feathered - time will tell.

okay some more updates from the G&G Stud. I had a big "AWWWWW NUTS" session this morning when I realized that the 2 fallow chicks that I have so far bred are cinnamon fallows, one of which is in a nest also containing lacewings. If anyone else has ever bred cinnamon fallows you will know that telling them apart from lacewings is pretty darn difficult. I'm hoping the quality differences between my lacewings and my fallows will help in this case. One of these is the cinnamon fallow ........ sigh. The little cobalt cock bird is looking nicer and nicer. Has the size and feather that might make him a bit of a stand out later (fingers crossed). He was a bit unhappy about being held!!! My first ever Dom Pieds just fledging. I've never bred pieds before and wasn't intending to start in any real way but I bought a dilute dom pied hen to use in my clearwings and she is so nice I put her to a normal green cock first, so I've obviously got a couple of pieds showing up. Still kind exciting for me coz pied is not something I'm used to seeing in the nest. Maybe a bit early to really tell yet but this little clearwing is looking promising as far as wing markings goes. The mighty mighty blackeye. This bird is huge for the variety and will be up there in size with my normals. Colour is fab too with little suffusion...... maybe it'll be a representative at the Nats???? Big fingies crossed. These 2 chickies are from 2 very nice birds. Brother to one of my lacewing Nats boys with ahen that was selected as third bird this year. 3 chickies so far with a great looking cin op grey and the white lacewing from the previous post just a bit more mature and showing really nice markings. These are the parents of the 2 chicks above. A bit hard to pick up on the photo but if you look carefully at the head feathering of this little guy you will see a real feather disturbance near to the cere. This is the second baby lacewing to show up this way (and no I don't have feather faults...... I mean crested budgies) so i'm wondering what this is exactly. This is the younger of the 2 and the second on as the feather is growing out, looks less noticable but still there. I will continue to show some photos as they grow.

Magnificent violets there Splat!