Penny

Since my post of the other day, I have done a little bit of research and I found that what my budgie was doing in the hours before he died was a type of behaviour that is mainly seen in Eclectus parrots. It is called Toe Tapping & Wing Flipping. However, Eclectus don't normally die and even though there are few different theories as to its cause, the most popular theory is dietery related - over supplementation of certain vitamins/minerals. Other speculative causes are fortified foods, preservatives, colours, additives, metal toxicity, pesticides, chemicals, calcium deficiency & food allergies. The only possible cause in the case with my budgie could have been a food allergy. He would literally eat ANYTHING and earlier on in the night had tried to get into some horrible Maccas that one of the children had brought home. It was some type of salsa sauce on a burger. Except for this, these causes don't seem to relate to my little bird so I guess I will never know what else was going on and what went wrong. Thank you to all who answered - I really appreciate the kind words.

Hi, Up until very early Friday morning my family and I lived alongside a much loved sky blue recessive pied budgerigar. He was just over 12 months old and seemingly healthy - very active, eating well, playing chattering etc. He hadn't been exposed to draughts, pesticides, chemicals or poisons of any kind. I don't use, or even possess Teflon pans, so no fumes from those either. He hadn't eaten avocado and I don't have indoor plants. He lived inside the house and spent most of his time outside his cage with me as I am lucky enough not to have to work outside the home. Leading up to his death, he hadn't had any signs of being fluffed up or sleepy. He hadn't vomited or had diarrhoea. The only things that I could say I ever questioned were every now and then he would sneeze a couple of sneezes in a row and they were wet sneezes. This would happen say once a week, maybe less, but not more. There was no staining above the cere. When he was a few months old I took him to an avian vet and his impression was there was no staining above cere, nostrils were clear and not to worry as it would be due to dust acting as an irritant, but to bring him back if the nasal discharge (when sneezing) became anything but clear or if his symptoms changed or got worse. Nothing changed - so life went on as normal. The other mysterious thing he would do was get overheated very easily - even when it wasn't hot. For instance he was incredibly bonded to me and my partner and would get close as possible to our faces and mouths to kiss us and to hear us talk to him. Within half a minute he would be holding his wings away from his body - slightly, but enough to notice. Sometimes he would do this for no apparent reason and occasionally his wings would quiver or shiver. It would last no more that 30 seconds and be over. I am also not sure if this is relevant but I am searching for why he died andif I have allowed it to happen by not acting when I could have. Anyway, when he preened/groomed part of his ritual involved kicking his legs/feet up to hisbutt - seemingly to something off. However, there was never any debris thereand he was mite/lice free so have no idea why he did it as none of my otherbudgies have. Incidentally, he only occasionally slept on one leg. This is the lead up to his death: On Thursday just past he seemed to be of normal character – eating normally andplaying etc. At about 3am on Friday morning, (crazily), I was at my computertrying finishing off some incomplete work. Budge was asleep in his cage on thetable and I noticed he had woken and had come down to the door to be let out. Iturned the light on and he came over to sit near my laptop (a favourite placefor him). He was not fluffed up. He proceeded to groom his feet and legsdesperately – almost like he had lice, mites, or ants biting/irritating him. Iput my hand down for him and instead of hopping on; he put his head to the sidefor me to scratch him – something that he doesn't readily offer on a whim. Iwas surprised and concerned so I picked him up fairly easily (again somethinghe would usually see coming and fly off), to see what was wrong with his feet/legs.I took him to a bright lamp and could see nothing so I put him back in his cagebut left the light on to observe him. He had stopped grooming but had startedopening and closing each of his feet alternately – somewhat, like walking onthe spot, he looked agitated. This went on for a minute or so – he started tolook quite distressed. He jumped down from his perch and continued moving histoes/feet – by now I was extremely worried and took him out. He stood on myhand and continued to flex his toes in and out, he now started to hold hiswings out from his body and they started to quiver. He still wasn't fluffed up.It was now almost4am. It's still quite warm up here but I got a heat pad andput the aircon on warm. I put him back in his cage and he continued to move hisfeet/legs. He didn't want to perch and stood on the bottom of his cage. Hedidn't stay on the heat pad and moved away from it. I gave him seed and waterwith Quikgel (Rob Marshall product). I droppered him a little quickgel waterand he climbed to my shoulder and continued to twitch his wings a little andmove his feet. This behaviour seemed to diminish but when I took him from myshoulder he had dropped down to a horizontal position and his eyes had thatterrible vacant look. I have a few medications in the fridge as I have learned that small animal vetstry to help, but birds are different to cats, dogs and guinea pigs, so it'shard for them too and an acutely sick bird would be hard pressed to travel12+hrs in a car to the nearest avian vet in either Brisbane or Toowoomba. Fromthis part of the world I usually phone consult with an avian vet in Sydney whenI have had problems with my other birds. But at 5am no chance of that. Feelingdesperate and totally out of my depth, I droppered him some broad spectrumantibiotic. He was weak, and hadn't attempted to stand or move and his eyeswere now closed. It was a desperate attempt to fix him but it was either thewrong thing to do, the wrong meds or too little too late - He didn't open hiseyes again and took his last breath at 7.45am. I haven't been able to ring theavian vet and speak to him about what might have happened but I will do so inthe next couple of days when I am feeling a bit less emotional. Any ideas or insight would be appreciated. Thank you. Not a great photo, but was taken the day before he died.

I PENNY AS KNOWN ON THIS FORUM FROM NSW AUSTRALIA AGREE TO ALLOW ANY OF MY PHOTOS OF MY BIRDS FROM ANY OF MY POSTS THREADS ON THIS FORUM TO BE COPYED AND TRANSFORMED INTO PAINTINGS/DRAWINGS BY THE FORUM MEMBER KNOWN AS GENERICBLUE AND FOR THESE PICTURES/PAINTINGS TO BE DISPLAYED AS SHE SO CHOOSES DATED OCTOBER 23, 2011.

Hi GB, I have always loved these pics. The first might be a good Christmas image, and the second - maybe it looks a bit agro??? Anyway, good luck with it all!

Why don't you leave the budgies as they are, (outside in the aviary), and keep the lovebird as an indoor pet. I've never had both budgies and lovebirds together so I cannot comment on that aspect, however, it kind of defeats the purpose of getting a single hand reared bird if its going outside into an aviary, (this is aside from the fact it may act aggressively towards your budgies). Also, logically, I don't think hand rearing would stop a lovebird from showing aggression if they have a territorial/aggressive nature. I have a lorkieet who is hand reared and is the sweetest of birds, however, I know my budgie wouldn't stand a chance if I left them out together. I know a lorikeet is much bigger than a lovebird, but even if the lovebird annoyed the budgies at the very least, it wouldn't really be fair on them would it?

I have put up 15 posters around my area and am about to put out the last of 165 flyers (in letter boxes). I will also, as suggested by Hezz, put a lost and found advert in this weeks local paper. There is nothing else I can do, only wait and hope that she has been lucky enough to have been caught by someone. To be honest I am not that hopeful as she is pretty timid and has been gone for 24 hours now in cold weather, she's also in the middle of a moult, which knocks her around a bit in itself.

I have lost my little female budgie named Beanie. It was my fault as I didn't close our front door properly and since it was windy here yesterday, the front door blew open. Both she and another male flew out. I got the my male back easily, however she was not with him and I am beside myself with guilt, and fear for her safety - it's so cold now. This happened yesterday afternoon about 2pm. I left the light on last night and have left her cage where it's visible and am playing recordings of budgies so she might be able to hear and come back. I am also going to distribute some flyers. There is a small aviary up the road and I will go and see the owners asap, (they haven't been home as yet). Beanie is a yellow face, double factor dominant pied, nearly 3 years old. She is much loved but still very flightly/timid. She loves her cage and mirrors , so if someone did see her and wanted to lure her down a mirror could help with that. I am just waiting to see if she will come back or be found. At the very least I hope she has gone down to someone's house and they have taken her in.

Sure - it could be everytime we get a cold snap. If that's the case, once the weather is consistently cold during winter the moulting should settle down. During late Sept we moved from a warm, tropical climate to a cold one, so maybe she's a bit confused. I will keep an eye on her though as she seems to get a bit run down and even her beak gets flakey.

Hi, my 2 yr old female budgie Beanie seems to moult frequently. For instance, she is moulting now, and this is the 3rd time since early December. When she is moulting her beak becomes a bit flakey. She also seems to be a little bit quieter, sometimes looks a bit bedraggled and her droppings get a bit wetter (not diahorrea - just more urine). I usually give her vitamins and minerals but haven't any at the moment - however the vitamins didn't seem to make a difference in the past. Her diet hasn't changed and her appetite is always good. She doesn't go bald or anything and when her new feathers grow back she looks beautiful and sleek and goes back to normal. This cycle just seems to happen too frequently - some advice about this would be appreciated. Thanks.

It does sound like he is 'feeding' things. It's a really normal thing for a male budgie to do, especially one kept on his own - not a bad habit - just instinct. I don't think there's any way to stop it. My male budgie continued to 'feed' his favourite things even after he acquired a female friend. He would feed his lady and then go and feed our digital clock, his favourite perch and then the hook from which their cage hung! He was a very busy budgie! As far as getting him a friend, a female budgie would work - if you don't want them to reproduce don't allow them access to anything that resembles a nest box. Otherwise, I think that males get along well together. My very, very tame budgie, Coco, was 6 months old when we got him his little female friend, Beanie. Although he kept his little lady to himself, and she didn't become very friendly at all, it didn't affect his bonding with me. I spent a lot of time with, firstly him, and then both of them, and he just just continued to get tamer and tamer - amazingly so. Anyway, this has been my experience with my little budgies.

Hi, I gather the oil wasn't hot, and if not I would wash the bird in warm water with some 'no more tears' baby shampoo, warm rinse it and then let it dry off in a warm, warm spot. Maybe under a light - the same as what you would do for a sick budgie. I'm not sure if there is anything else you could do. It would depend on how oily the bird was as to how effective washing it will be. Hopefully someone with more specific experience will reply. Good luck.

Thanks Kaz, I'll try to find one ready made first at the 2 pet shops and if I have no luck then I'll make one using a nest box I think.

Oops, I am sure if I can't make one that the airport sells them, inquire there. They are ment to be light weight and small. Yes, I thought they would have them there (Aust. Air Express Sydney), but apparently not. At least that was what I was told not when I first rang to enquire. I was told they only had options for dogs and cats. I might ring tomorrow morning just in case - before I go searching.

Hopefully, this is the right place for me to post. I have to travel interstate and I have just bought a new little budgie (which I just posted about yesterday). I have decided I am going to take him with me as he is separated/quarantined from my others and I am not confident to leave him at home to be looked after. Also I'm probably going to be away for a couple of weeks so I feel it's too long for me to leave with a carer. I have booked on a qantas flight and him too and now I need a travel box. Please does anyone know where I can purchase such a cage? I fly out tuesday and if I can't buy one I'll have to make one tomorrow (if I can).

Well, thanks everyone. I'll post again in a few months when there's maybe something more definitive to look at. I don't really care if it's a boy or girl, but I do like to at least make a bit of a guess, and I like to hear about what experienced breeders see so I can try and see the same thing. Like I said previously, my female budgie Beanie, I was sure, (100%!) was a male, but over a few months there was a striking transformation to say the least!

Thank you all. I thought boy too. However, like I said, just a guess, cause I thought my other budgie was a boy and he turned out to be a surprise she. I didn't use a flash Splat, and I can see what you mean about the white around the nostrils - so confusing.

Hi there, Here is my new (and as yet un-named), little baby budge. I'm not sure if it's female or male and I've been wrong in picking many babies I have seen that I'm not even going to try and guess this one . He/she's the sweetest little thing! Thanks for helping me out. Trying to do too much at once and I forgot to add the photo. Anyway here goes.

At the moment Beanie can fly perfectly well - at least whilst the deformed feather is still small. I'll take her to an avian vet as soon as I'm in NSW and hopefully the deformed feather will be able to be removed. She'll be minus a flight feather but that's okay, so long as she recovers and is happy afterwards. I can't believe what's happened and how. I think partly it's because she isn't used to being caged. I'm at home so my budgies are free to come and go from their cage at will (except at night - I lock them in then). When I have had to lock Beanie in during the day (ie visitors arriving), she's quite feral in her cage, almost turning herself inside out while clinging to the bars, digging all the seed out of the feeder & tugging at the water container until there's none left. So she must've been doing that sort of thing and no one thought to stop/distract her (like I would do). Thanks Kaz for your input and advice. Dave did your budgie suffer the same feather injury as Beanie or was it also involving the bone/joint of the wing? Beanie seems only to have the feather issue, the joint seems perfectly normal and she flies as well as ever. Though that's only for now, things may change if the feather continues to grow to it's full size - then it's sure to cause problems.

I have read the forum information on feather cysts. I'll leave the deformed feather alone for now. I'm moving to NSW next week and I'll take Beanie to an avian vet when I get there (there are none even remotely close where I live now anyway). I just can't see how she will go with this feather growing in this way (curving around). If it continues to grow to a normal length it's got to cause problems for her, I can't see how it couldn't when it would curl up under her wing. Maybe a vet could remove it and the apparently damaged follicle so it wouldn't ever grow back. I think a missing flight feather would be preferable to what would happen if this feather continues to grow.

Thanks Kaz for your reply. I only discovered this today and I am pretty upset. I will watch out for a feather cyst which I have never seen but imagine would be a lump type thing. But what should I do about what is there now - the feather in question seems to be growing around in a curve. Should I just let it grow and see how much it affects her or should I pull it out now? It looks awful and I feel so sorry for the poor little thing.

Hi, I was recently away for a few days and left my budgies in the care of a friend. Whilst being looked after Beanie got her wing stuck in her swing (I'm not sure how). Beanie was in the process of growing a new primary wing feather and in the accident it broke. Apparently, because she was struggling and the amount of blood, the feather in question was a bit hard to find so a couple of her wing feathers were pulled in the hope of stopping the bleeding. Obviously it stopped the bleeding and Beanie is okay. However, now the feathers have started to grow back, one of them is mishapen (sort of twisted around). The other feathers growing back seem fine. Beanie is 2 years old and she has had perfect feathers up until this incident. She doesn't seem to be in any discomfort and it doesn't seem to annoy her in anyway. Does anyone know what's wrong here and if anything can be done to fix what's happened to her?

just remember this is not what i do all time this was just a once over whole flock treatment as i had birds straggling from everywhere when i started show birds and when i stopped purchasing my birds never really seemed right i did quarrenteen anyway i did what vet said birds all seem good i only bring in birds at same time now never just randomly from everywhere your vet will fix you up with a good plan to stick too Thanks GenericBlue for your advice. I can see that you wouldn't want to carry out a medicated quarantine programme too often. Though I can definitely see the benefit if you had experienced sickness/loss in an aviary - very upsetting and stressful. I am waiting to see how my quarantine bird goes (he seems great) and I'm also closely watching my hen who was in with Sunny when she first fell ill. So far she is okay. I still have the male bird BT separated and am going to take him to the new vet for further investigation and at the same time I will ask about a quarantine/medication plan such as the one you posted. Once I know for sure that the birds I have are okay I am going to aim to get some birds from 1 source, maybe a breeder, and not from the petshop/produce store where the birds come from everywhere. Anyway thanks again for your input which is much appreciated.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I really appreciate your reply GenericBlue. I so need a plan and I will definitely follow this protocol. I had already separated BT (the not quite healthy bird) from the other 2 when they all got sick last month. I had also decided not to breed with him as well. (Hence the new boy in quarantine). So to hear you say the same makes me feel I am on the right track with that anyway. He isn't a new bird, I have had him for about 7 months and I also did quarantine with him. He was never right from first up and I've had him to the vet many times. First visit was during quarantine due to extremely wet droppings & regurgitation. And then just after quarantine he was diagnosed over the phone by Vetafarm with trichomoniasis. Then the local vet diagnosed him with psittacosis and the treatment for that nearly killed him. Generally, he's happy and sings away but he's thin, has extremely wet droppings (polyuria), sometimes seems to have flaky material in his nostrils (though never any wetness) and is very thirsty. I first noticed the excessive thirst when I did the treatment with Psittavet - like I said I think it nearly killed him so treatment was stopped. I bought him as an untamed adult so can you imagine a non tame bird trying to dive into your glass of water? (usually he won't go anywhere near you). Anyway, he's going to go for some tests with the new vet I have and maybe something will come of it finally. As he hasn't actually died I am most worried he's harbouring something that's been missed and that he may transfer to the others (not sure if that's possible). Or maybe he did have something before I got him that's damaged his system somehow. Who knows? But I sure would like to! Thank you again for your plan. I feel more confident now to get some new birds – although as you suggested I will aim for getting them all at the one time and go from there.

Yes, you're absolutely right. I need a plan. I've been thinking that over last few weeks either get birds from 1 source or routine meds during quarantine. With each bird I have purchased I did quarantine without meds (only basic worm and pests) and when I noticed something odd took the bird to the vet but because it wasn't dying was sent home to worm it. It sort of put me off taking the birds there for anything other than near death, certainly not advice. Anyway the vet I have found who treated Sunny is very nice/approachable, but not an avian vet. I have read a lot on here and elsewhere on the net regarding other peoples practices with routine meds. I need a good book and a good avian vet I think (only no avain vets north of Brisbane area by the looks - maybe/hopefully I'm wrong?). For 2 years I have been planning on breeding budgies and wanted to have 6 to 8 in total (I mean 3 to 4 pairs) I now have only 3 budgies and I'm very sus on the health of 1 of them. I have posted about him before as he's been sick and even though he recovered and seems fine in himself his droppings continue to be abnormal. I have also taken him in for consults before to no avail and no diagnosis. So really I am totally aware that in actual fact I am left with just 2 suitable budgies, one of which is still in quarantine (goodness, poor fellow, what a lot of pressure on him to perform!). I'm not doing too well so far despite doing all the right things with the ones I have got.

Thank you so much for your replies. I have got a few medications now for different things and the only trouble is I don't have the knowlege or the confidence to self prescribe and in Sunny's case I didn't know which one to use or which could be used in conjuction with the other. The vet had said that antibiotic treatment was not necessary as Sunny didn't show a bacterial infection. I wonder if she did have one as well as the mega and they just didn't spot it. I'm not sure if that's even possible (that they could miss something). I'm not upset with the vet that treated Sunny - she really tried her best to treat her based on what she saw. Our own local vets, there are 3, don't do crop washes or any faecal diagnostics at all, so I feel lucky that I found a someone within driving distance that could. I guess my fear is if the others start becoming symtomatic whilst they are on the medication for the mega. Take them back to the vet I guess is all I can do. I really have respect for all of you who breed your birds and do it consciously and with care and keep it going smoothly. I only have four little pets and was yet to get to the point of partnering them up for breeding (Sunny was the youngest so I was waiting for her to grow up) and I have had sickness and death. Ironically, I feel I am very particular with everything I do with them. You know we had a couple of pet budgies at different times when I was going up and they were never neglected by any stretch, however they certainly didn't get the same effort in care that my budgies get now and they lived for 10 or 12 years and as far as I remember they never got sick and definately didn't see a vet in their life. So I wonder if mine have have come to me with already underlying infection of some sort that doesn't show up as acute and is missed that way. I mean I notice things and I've taken both Sunny and 1 of the others to the vet about what I've noticied and because they haven't been fluffed up and acute they send me home with some worm medicine. I know with Sunny the faecal part of her droppings always looked a little pale (grey/green) from when I got her about 7 months ago. I took her to the vet (local) they said nothing to worry about, she was bright, active, not puffy etc etc etc. But maybe she did harbour something all along. Maybe I should have sent her droppings to be tested myself. I wish I could know. Sorry for raving on but no one to talk to about my budgies. I really appreciate any feedback.