**KAZ**

These two out in the aviary....

If you have asked for the pedigree of these birds and if you know how to work with sex linked varieties, you would not have this problem.

Dont mean to hijack your thread Maes, but I so love these old projects. I have a project or two to do as well, inherited from my father when he was alive. He gave me an ancient old metal safe that is designed and made from the Art Nouveau era. Dated around 1890 to 1910. Its rusty looking but will spruce up real nice.....I intend to strip it back, fix the lo0cks and paint it black again with gold leaf over the flower embossed metal in the art nouveau styling. Here is the befores after will have to wait :question: I also have the toy I rode around on when I was a kid Looks like this...... I am yet to restore it.

Message to any budgie enthusiasts out there that are now afraid to ask about the leg ring info on the bird they just bought at the pet store................. Most of us will help you out. Dont judge all people by one persons attitude :question:

Nope. I have rarely followed up on that. Perhaps if I was planning on on-selling and I just wanted to confirm my hunch. I am a visual breeder of families. I trust my gut before anything anyone says, I have learnt that from the best. :question: That doesnt make sense. Even the biggest and best show breeders wouldnt buy a visual bird without also getting background. And why would you seek out background based on hunches ....only if you are onselling a bird ?

I did not buy those birds off you to onsell Renee. I dont do things like that. I had them long enough to see their potential or not and as they didnt cut the mustard ( and you are aware of that as I told you they didnt turn out well ) I GAVE them away. Do not assume anything...you will, in all likelihood be wrong when assuming what people do or dont do.Of course they didn't cut mustard ~ they were slated for the Pet Shop as I told you at the time! In fact I was privately horrified you wanted them at all. I only hope that the people you gave them to were not aspiring Show budgie breeders and under no illusions as to their quality. :rofl:I am just gonna go away shaking my head.......I have answers but for the life of me........its just not worth the aggravation to respond anymore :happy-dancing: A phrase comes to mind from the bible "Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." Hebrews 13:2 To my mind it means be good to all fellow men, do all you can, help all you can for they may be angels ( good people ) in disguise, someone of consequence, someone of worth. Treat everyone you meet like a treasure unless you are given good reason not to.....and even then.... If you adopt this attitude in all walks of life where you can, it will be paid back to you a hundrefold in ways you least expect. So to take a moment...just a moment to reach for information at your fingertips, regardless of how much someone paid for a bird or where they got it.........what does it take out of us ? Does it rob is of self worth ? does it rob us of the birds real value ? do we fear them utilising the bird in a better way and beating us on the bench ? A moment taken to assist makes a new budgie owner happier about their purchase, pleased with a positive response, and perhaps thinking they may take this budgie interest a little further. These are the budgie show breeders of the future. Giving them short shift or a flea in the ear for daring to ask robs a person of their reputation, esteem and value in another persons eyes.

Another warmish day again and more to come it seems with a cooler break over the weekend. Budgies look like string beans, not gorgeous feathery show budgies :happy-dancing:

If a small minority of breeders do not want the follow up inquiries from their cull sales they should cut the rings off. End of story. :happy-dancing:

Now i know this isnt about a dog and i know I am gatecrashing the " dog topic" :rofl: but i have been telling Ken for ages that my cat RUSKIE often sleeps with his eyes open. He didnt believe me....But here is the proof :happy-dancing: Believe it or not he is fast fast asleep......Wave your hands in front of his eyes and dont wake up kind of asleep. When he reaches that deep sleep his eyelids open and his eyes are wide open although he's asleep. :laughter:

Full photos required please, as even in that photo a heavily wing marked recessive pied will look exactly like that :happy-dancing: Whenever you ask for mutation or sexing..............full clear photos required.

:happy-dancing:

I did not buy those birds off you to onsell Renee. I dont do things like that. I had them long enough to see their potential or not and as they didnt cut the mustard ( and you are aware of that as I told you they didnt turn out well ) I GAVE them away. Do not assume anything...you will, in all likelihood be wrong when assuming what people do or dont do. BACK ON TOPIC When we all start out we check out all the petshops first and we buy what we think are " show birds" ....in doing so we often end up with more rubbish or birds with health issues we hadnt counted on. Then we usually join a club and see things differently. Someone once told me that we will change our aviary of birds three times before we begin to stick with and breed with what we have..........( Thanks Rob D ) ....he was right. Rob D was also the breeder of one of my purchased petshop culls and once I tracked him down was only too happy to not only give me the breeding history but became a mentor and helped me anyway he could. There have been some very good mentors along the way........wonderful helpful people. There is much said these days about bringing new blood into our hobby and keeping new and young members. How we treat an inquiring budgie purchaser today is the potential show breeding member of the future. Might pay to be a little nicer to people and not so hard nosed. PS Amy S ....I hope you enjoy your new birds...a " gift" from me but no $$$'s exchanged hands. :rofl:

Hay has been known to harbour mice, and also to encourage some birds to breed amongst it. Your choice.

Well I had birds from you once, and then we had Liv over here from S.A. Chances are high she passed one on. And as you dont seem to keep records of your culls....I guess the new owner will never know anything from you. Well as it happens my record keeping is a little bit better than that. And of the 9 hens I gifted you at $10 each it just so happens that this bird was a cock. :happy-dancing: Moreover it was a bird bred a full year before those ones. Well....the cock didnt come from me then. I dont have any of your birds left here, as I passed them on. Gifted and $$'s dont go well together. One way of trying to say someone got a bargain I guess. But as I passed them all along and didnt end up using them I wioll never know what kind of " gift" they were :laughter:

Well I had birds from you once, and then we had Liv over here from S.A. Chances are high she passed one on. And as you dont seem to keep records of your culls....I guess the new owner will never know anything from you. Also Liv bought birds at the auction where you sold birds and it could have been amongst those.

Perhaps instead of asking the questions you would like to explain how you do things? That way this debate can be more inclusive instead of so one way. Renee..............you opened this "can of peas" all by yourself by your post. On the contrary Kaz, I am most interested in how you acquire Show budgies! Do you, like me, just buy direct from breeders and at auctions or do you still trawl the Pet Shops hoping to pick up a bargain for yourself or friend? No I dont trawl petshops for birds Renee....I have no need to. Try getting back on topic and stop trying to draw me into this.

Perhaps instead of asking the questions you would like to explain how you do things? That way this debate can be more inclusive instead of so one way. Renee..............you opened this "can of peas" all by yourself by your post. It has nothing to do with me and trying to divert the topic off onto me is a questionable move. My question is.................Arent records begun before hatching and onwards. How can you decide well before hatching that they are petshop birds and worthy of records or not ?

I have my top breeders, and then I have the rest. Personally I am proud of all my bred birds but even through my pink tinted glasses I have to acknowledge that only a percentage will reach my standards and funnily enough they always seem to come from the same birds or a family of birds. From the "possibles" I usually make up my mind before they are released into the aviary and by that time I have been tracking them from the nest. I always say I don't pay much attention to my chicks till they start to feather up, but from that moment I am watching very carefully. If a "surprise" grabs my attention then I pay more attention to it! That does not answer my question at all

I agree with speaking out when people are being sold old birds as babies etc etc BUT Ratzy......................females DO talk Admittedly not older ones being passed off as trainable babies ..........BUT females do talk. The thing about only males being talkers is an old wives tale.

split topic I have split this topic away from its original one as it has taken on a life of its own Not those destined for the Pet Shop, they get bought on looks alone! Arent records begun before hatching and onwards. How can you decide well before hatching that they are petshop birds and worthy of records or not ? Or do you breed a line of cr*p birds just for the petshop and just to pay for the feed for your others ?

Topic has been split as it went off on a tangent http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....c=28066&hl=

Renee if you think you have a following and you think you wouldnt want to assist anyone buying your birds to get your bloodlines or "pedigrees"...you can always cut their legrings off when you sell to the petshop....BUT that would get you less $$'s for them wouldnt it ?

Forum member DrNat posted this once too Nov 21st 2008 and forum member Jade posted this

In a yellow bird the flights would be white if a clearflighted pied wouldnt it ? Like this boy I once had Bubblegum

There would be no difference. A budgie that speaks is down to how much the owner works with it. One of my budgie babies went to a new home with a lady that had lost her 14 year old budgie ( it died ) and the baby she got from me now speaks around a hundred phrases. She spends a lot of time talking with him. There is no such thing as an American budgie ....its a name adopted by Americans to describe their pet sized budgies. In America things get renamed a lot.....budgies are incorrectly called parakeets. Pet types called American and show types called English. Doesnt happen most other places in the world.