**KAZ**

Bearing this in mind KAZ would you change the pairings around so the DF was paired to the Rec Pied Cock and the Violet paired with the Dom Pied Hen or would you not pair a DF Spangle to a Pied either? Spangle of a decent size and quality is likely to improve the size of a recessive pied, but a DF spangle could be hiding anything so unless you know what its a gamble.

Spangle is dominant and you will see it....it wont "carry "it. Since you ask if it is also spangle you need to ppost a picture of the full wings. Whenever you ask mutations questions posting a few reasonable photos front and back, wings and tail is NECESSARY. Head and shoulder photo isnt enough.

We breed during the best weather..........not too cold and not too hot. Depends where in the world you are ( I know where you are ) and what your temperatures are like. You have to make your choices based on your weather, the time it takes from mating to fledging chicks and what the weather is like then, and also birds being in condition through it all. You cannot necessarily always go by the calender. For instance...we have had really hot weather and now for at least a week it has been mild...so I have put several pairs down to breed based on the weather.

Would cause trauma and may cause her to break eggs and or become an egg eater.

Well with those two you are going to get all spangles. The DF is a yellowface white DF spangle too, so all babies will be blue series and some will be yellowface, some will be cinnamon. as for percentages I cannot tell you. DF spangle mask other mutations in the same kind of way that inos do so there may be surprises. As for the other pair I wouldnt mix two kinds of pieds myself.

Fences look great Dave !! Nice colour too.

The author of this article, Hans, sent it to me today to be used here on our forum for good advice to breeders

Interesting. Nothing natural sounding about those poops. You know my thoughts on pellets Wont go there again. Wonder what the birds actually do take out of the pellets and what is passed through the system ? :rofl:

HI Kaz - Just a nickname!! As I come from Italian extraction and often used to get called "ding" I assumed ding dong or dong was a derivative of that :rofl:

Putting the seed in ziplock bags in the freezer for a few days will help. It isnt just the bugs in the seed you have to worry about for the budgies...the things is they eat the middle out of most of the seed leaving very little nutrition for the budgie. Unfortunately often you have to throw it all out and start all over again. I run a mozzie zappper on the birdroom to get rid of the moths that lay their eggs in our seed and such.

Agreed.........male

KEEPING OUR BIRDS AND OURSELVES HEALTHY BY HANS SIBUM As has been mentioned before, this is a very important topic for me personally. As a very keen exhibition Budgerigars fancier, it is devastating to me to have to realize that I am one of the 4% of budgerigar fanciers that has succumbed to what is commonly known as “Budgerigars Fanciers Lung”. What is Budgerigar Fanciers Lung? Studies have shown that this disease is very common indeed. Budgerigar Fanciers Lung (or Allergic alveolitis) is not isolated to Budgerigar fanciers alone. “Pigeon Lung”, is a very common ailment amongst pigeon fanciers. Canary breeders too, can suffer from a similar ailment. Poultry breeders and owners of hatcheries and egg laying businesses often have to take precautions because of lung problems. Farmers lung is very common amongst farm workers who deal with dusty and mouldy feed and animal poop. This illness for Budgerigar fanciers, comes about as a direct result of too much exposure to feather dander, and other precipitins such as droppings, lice, mite and mould in feathers as a result of keeping and housing birds. There is also strong evidence that this exposure and the illness that result, can come from keeping as little as one budgerigar indoors or twenty birds in an aviary situation. It therefore concludes that we exhibition Budgerigar fanciers are at great risk of developing allergic lung reactions simply due to the fact that we keep so many birds (100 to 400) in a concentrated environment. How does this illness come about? The answer to this question is very simple indeed. Budgerigar Fanciers Lung comes about from breathing in all those nasty precipitins that float around in the air as our birds shed them in the breeding rooms and aviaries. These precipitins are not only found in feather dander and bird poop. It has been proven that the incidence of mite in the feathers of our birds also is a major cause of allergy. Studies done of pigeon feathers have shown that as much as 10% of the weight of some feathers was made up of various mites. These can cause severe reactions in human respiratory systems as they are inhaled. What are the symptoms? In my case I suffered a dry cough for a couple of years. I had a lung function test done four years ago at my Doctors surgery. This showed up very good lung function both inhaling and exhaling. My Doctor said I had very good lungs; in fact my figures were equivalent to those of an athlete. However I was starting to notice that I couldn’t keep up with the kids I was coaching in an under sixteen soccer competition. I wasn’t willing to put this down to the fact that I was getting older. I was coughing quite badly when I went from a warm room into a cold room or vice versa. Smells of cleaning fluids and chemicals started my coughing fits and I was now sneezing quite a lot. This got so bad that eventually I found it difficult to do my work as my nose was always runny and often bleeding as well. Eventually this progressed to a build up of fluids in my lungs which I found particularly difficult to clear. My mucous membranes were always irritated and my sinus would drain at night as I slept making me quite uncomfortable. At first I didn’t worry too much, but as time went on I became slightly breathless after even minor activity. Upon visiting my Doctor and mentioning to him that I kept birds, I was put on Doxycycline tablets for four months as his and my first diagnosis was Chlamydia Pssittaci. When this didn’t seem to help I had lung x-rays taken and these didn’t really show anything to be overly concerned about. When the coughing persisted and in fact worsened I had some pathology done on my lung sputum by a Bacteriarologist. This resulted in a diagnosis of Chlamydia Pneumonia, which is a community acquired Pneumonia. I was then prescribed another two months of Doxycycline. When symptoms persisted and progressed even worse, I knew I had to get to the bottom of my lung condition. My Doctor booked me in a Sir Charles Gardiner Hospital, where I had about 6 hours of lung tests done, (Inhalation provocation tests). I was placed in a booth and made to inhale oxygen mixed with Saline and allergens at increasing percentages. This showed up that my lungs had lost about 19% of their function from my last tests. This is classed as nearing diagnosis to a severe asthmatic. (Severe is when 20% or more is measured in the lung tests). It was at this time I began to realize that I had to take this condition very seriously. The lung Specialist at Sir Charles Gardiner Hospital told me that if I persisted in my avian pursuits I would eventually become a severe patient. She told me that she has many patients who at forty years of age find it difficult to walk up a flight of stairs. Her advice was this; “Give up your birds or you will get very sick”. I decided I wouldn’t tell my wife or family what the doctor had said as I loved this hobby. I started wearing a mask whenever I was cleaning in my birdroom or aviary. I began to notice that I was getting itchy when I put my hands in seed or when I opened the nest boxes to look at my babies. I also sneezed almost uncontrollably whenever I was in the bird room. My Doctor then sent me to an Allergy/Lung Specialist. Test conformed I had become allergic to house dust mite, mould and fungus, some chemicals (bleach, solvents etc) and bird dander and poop. Surprisingly the specialist was not at all perturbed by my allergies. He told me that it is very common. He put me on a weekly course of needles. Allergens were pumped into my body for 18 months and this was intended to stimulate my immune system to combat the adverse reaction to allergens. As time went on I had on a few of occasions embarked on overseas holidays to Asia with my wife. It was she who noticed I wasn’t coughing and sneezing when I was in a bird free environment. Bingo, she hit the nail on the head, and together we decided that it would be best for my health if I sold my birds. My last lung function test (a month ago) showed that my lungs were on the improve and that my reaction to allergens had already lessened. I have been bird free for four or five weeks now and have hardly sneezed in that time. I haven’t had a nose bleed for about four months. The needles are definitely helping and have kicked my immune system into a higher level of protection. Are all fanciers going to become allergic? Of course not all fanciers will become allergic to their birds and their hobby. However it would be foolish of us to expect that we will be amongst those fortunate enough to carry on year in year out and remain perfectly healthy. Statistics from numerous surveys have shown that a fair percentage of bird fanciers end up with some lung disorder or another. The most common age group of sufferers is around the age of fifty years of age. A survey carried out in North America among 1005 outpatient clinic Allergy suffers, found that 117 (12%) were current budgerigars fanciers and that 296 (29%) were former fanciers. These figures are quite staggering. It also showed that recovery in many cases, after cessation of exposure, could take many years. Most sufferers were cured within about two years of ceasing exposure to precipitins. Some are cured but react as soon as they are re-exposed to budgerigars. A survey carried out in England found that among Budgerigar fanciers in the general population, Budgerigar Fanciers Lung was as high as between 6.5% and 7.5%. This is similar to the prevalence of farmer’s lung in farm workers. This indicates that Budgerigar Fanciers Lung is by far the most common type of allergic alveolitis in Britain. Should I take these figures seriously? Only a fool would look at the abovementioned statistics and continue to ignore the dangers of exposure to Budgerigar dander, mites, mould and droppings. It makes good sense to look at your birdroom, your aviaries and the health of yourself and your birds, in an effort to deduce whether you can do anything at all to keep the whole environment healthy. How can I avoid exposure to these nasties? Before stating the obvious a few simple personal tests can be carried out. I will ask these in a question format for you to work out. * Does your skin and throat tighten up after exposure to your birds? * Do you have a persistent cough? * Do you have fluid on your lungs when you wake up in the mornings? * Does your skin itch when coming into contact with seed and grains? * Are suffering from breathlessness after activity? * Do you discover layers of dust on shelves and surfaces in your birdroom? * Can you see the dust particles floating around in the air of the birdroom and aviaries? * If the answer is yes to any of the above, you are at risk of allergic alveolitis. You can avoid some of the exposure by doing some of the following; * Ensure your birds are free of lice and mites. * Ensure there is ample movement of fresh outside air into your aviary and birdroom. * If possible have dust extractors fitted to birdrooms. * Use an ioniser in the birdroom. This will negative charge all dust particles and cause them to drop to the floor. Do maintain your ioniser or they will become ineffective. * Wear a suitable dust mask when handling or cleaning your birds and rooms. * Vacuum regularly with a high quality vacuum cleaner that has a filtration device fitted. (Ask your merchant). Don’t use a broom to sweep up dust. * Use a damp cloth when wiping surfaces and trays. * If possible have one side of the breeding room open to the outside air so that breezes will extract the foul air. * Fit whirly birds to the roof of your aviaries and birdrooms. * Wash your clothes after cleaning flights and birdroom. * Wear disposable gloves when cleaning and wash your hands after removing the gloves. * Avoid using fans that blow the dust around your birdroom. * Wash your hands with suitable alcohol based cleaners after handling your birds and don’t put your fingers in your mouth. If you bite your nails, now is a good time to stop. * If you smoke, you are at greater risk of lung damage. Stop smoking please. These are just some of the things we need to do as part of our normal daily activity in our birdrooms and aviaries. Common sense tells us that in the world we live in, with all the dangerous pollutants we are exposed to already, we would be foolhardy to not try to minimise health risks. A good solid Quarantine plan, sensible use of medications, a healthy varied diet, good disease control, intelligent planning of construction of bird rooms and aviaries and good personal hygiene are just some of the things we can do to keep the airspace as clean as possible. If you are concerned about the health of your respiratory system, see you Doctor and don’t take no for an answer. If problems persist, insist on doing every test possible, and see a Lung and allergy specialist. Your health is more important that your hobby. I have spoken to many people in the hobby about my allergy problems. Some have told me that they too suffer from coughing and fluid on the lungs. Some don’t realize that they have a persistent dry cough. Others assume Chlamydia Pssittaci as soon as a cough develops. It may be, but it also may be something else. ASK YOUR DOCTOR. I hope this has been informative. Hans Sibum

Dogs are locked up ? or away at relatives ?

We would all be hoping for good things here too

Try posting a close up of the budgies cere. That one doesnt show enough

SCATT is available where you are and yes vaseline can be used in earlier stages BUT your bird now has a misshapen beak due to the mites. I suggest strongly a vet visit is in order in case the beak needs reshaping/trimming and do noit rely on petshop products or vaseline now as it has gone a little further than that.

Hi Brad There must be a story to the name DONG :rofl:

Like I said,,,,,,,,,,,,dont worry about things that havent happened. :rofl: Older females can become chronic egglayers and any female who thinks there is a good place to lay eggs may lay eggs. Chronic egg layers arent normal and are a SMALL percentage of the female budgies. Most females do not on the whole become chronic egglayers. Of all my hundreds and hundreds of budgies I have never had one. No large seed dishes, snuggle huts, no nestboxes being given as places to sleep and you shouldnt have to worry about if she might start egg laying. I think you are worrying for nothing to be honest. Just because you have a female budgie does NOT mean she will start acting like a female chicken and begin egg production.

Gotcha about the blue budgie :rofl: Two pairs in a cage is still colony breeding and the hardest way to breed budgies. Check their cere colour and also if they are moulting. Timing may all be off. Double check all your budgies for real breeding condition ( not dark brown and flaky........lighter brown to medium ) and double check their ages. PM.............you got a how to use the forum email when you joined....you need to go back and read it all. But click on my name on the left of post, then send message and then you write a message and send Easy once you have done it a couple of times

The blue one sitting on the nestbox in the photo....but could be moulting. PM me who you bought the birds off ( as there is a guy who is a little unscrupulous and seliing rubbish birds ).

would they be the what looks like a yf grey and the rec pied and grey green cin cause the way they all are sitting they would be my guess for younger birds but as i said i cant see them do they have white iris rings bar of course the rec pied The dom pied is a baby and the YF maybe too young as well...........

Did you mean to answer this ?

First thing I notice is how close and stacked the nestboxes are............ Way too close and there will be territorial fights over anyone of the females claiming and keeping a box. How old are your budgies ? Two that I can seem to be young. You say they are club rung budgies....can you get the colour band info and the codes off them and let us know. and the blue budgie at the nestbox is missing flightss........either in the middle of moulting or french moult survivor. If moulting it shouldnt be breeding. What is in the black basket hanging off the back wall ?

That is really cool

For anyone wanting an easy little project for a budgies carrybox........... 1. buy a nestbox from the bird dealer. 2. Cover the nestbox hole with wire mesh...cit out a larger hole if you want but its not necessary.....remove the perch which should be wedged not glued in. If glued cut it flush with the nestbox face. 3. attach a carry handle to the top of the box. Remove the insert concave wooden section ( should be removable ) 4. The slide up and down nestbox lid becomes the part you put the bird in through, and you can drill a real small hole through the slide up and down lid into the thicker wood of the nestbox and screw in a metal "eye"..... these metal eyes are easy to screw in and undo by hand thereby securing the slider lid. an easy to make small carry box. Total cost should be under $10.