Are Auctions Killing Our Hobby

[clearwing 0]

Are auctions killing our hobby, let me explain: up until two years ago, I could ring most of Victorias top breeders and say " I have a begginner who wants a few pairs." I could take that begginner to visit the breeder and for $200-$400 a bird they could buy some breeding stock say 5 pairs. Now if I ring the same breebers they say so me,"sorry mate, I can't help you. If I sell your begginer 5 pair I'll get $3000, but if I put the same ten birds up for auction I might get $10,000." Given that this is a true and valid argument, my question is how many honest fanciers are going to be prevented from even starting in the hobby, because of the expense. And how does a parent give their teenage child the opportunity to try breeding budgerigars as a hobby. Call me old fashioned, but my concern is real as I've spent over 40 years in administration of Budgerigar Clubs.

[Dean_NZ 0]

True that. I spent $1000 last year (average $100 a bird) on the birds that are giving me nothing but *** this breeding season! My initial 'training wheels' stock was purchased for about $200 for about 3 or 4 lesser pairs which bred really well for me.

 

That $1000 was as much as I could afford which at an auction would maybe net me one single pair in NZ and you know the odds of success with a single pair are abysmal (sometimes they do super well but chances are one of the two wont perform). It is a struggle every year to 1) find good birds and 2) afford them!

Edited October 24, 2010 by Dean_NZ

[**KAZ** 0]

Good birds I could have once bought locally here in W.A. are on the whole being sent interstate now for auction money. Mostly all I can buy locally is the leftover rubbish...birds with issues. Theres a few here and there but not much. That forces me now to buy from interstate auctions if I am after new blood or better birds than I can get locally.

[kochy23 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

[Dean_NZ 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

 

You were definitely well treated, thats partly why i asked who it was lol. I know quite a few of the NZ breeders and the local prices so you should be well pleased with what you got. $30 each is an absolute steal, although for a beginner its just what you need. Go back to that breeder when you've bred a few birds and need outcrosses.

[**KAZ** 0]

Auctions are necessary. A great many of the birds at auctions are flown in from various states and breeders not normally accessible by most people. Some breeders only sell to auctions too. Many of these breeders are not just down the road and available for a home visit.

The "big money boys" at the auctions drive the prices up of course as the top birds command a following and they fight over owning the best.

Yes......there are still $30 birds to be had locally and even some in the bigger auctions too.

But its supply and demand that drives prices up. Its the competitive nature of man that drives prices up too. So, its called a HOBBY but is it an affordable hobby ?

I think it becomes an affordable hobby when your own birds produced, and often from the higher price birds you bought, are breeding, then produce enough saleable birds to cover the new ones you buy in. Sometimes this takes years. To get a good price for your culls these days you have to have a NAME and be doing extremely well on the show bench.

[clearwing 0]

Auctions are necessary. A great many of the birds at auctions are flown in from various states and breeders not normally accessible by most people. Some breeders only sell to auctions too. Many of these breeders are not just down the road and available for a home visit.

The "big money boys" at the auctions drive the prices up of course as the top birds command a following and they fight over owning the best.

Yes......there are still $30 birds to be had locally and even some in the bigger auctions too.

But its supply and demand that drives prices up. Its the competitive nature of man that drives prices up too. So, its called a HOBBY but is it an affordable hobby ?

I think it becomes an affordable hobby when your own birds produced, and often from the higher price birds you bought, are breeding, then produce enough saleable birds to cover the new ones you buy in. Sometimes this takes years. To get a good price for your culls these days you have to have a NAME and be doing extremely well on the show bench.

 

 

I guess Kaz that backs up y statement, it is very difficult to start at a reasonable level of quality, unless you have thousands of dollars to spend and can wait a few years for a return. For the record, I haven't sold any birds for 3 years, I've been giving them to begginners to try and "grow" our local club. Money isn't everything.

[**KAZ** 0]

. For the record, I haven't sold any birds for 3 years, I've been giving them to begginners to try and "grow" our local club. Money isn't everything.

I too give away birds to beginners as I remember where and how I started. Too many clubs complain about the lack of new members or juniors in the hobby. A lot of newish members fall away when they see the costs associated with the birds and often because they have been sold "dodgy" birds from other breeders

 

 

 

 

Auctions are only a small part of the problem as far as "killing the hobby " goes

 

There are many other reasons the hobby is in decline

 

In my experience ( my opinion only )

 

1. Clubs either dont know how or dont try anything new to bring in new members. Suggestions put forward are often dismissed by older more long term members. Times have changed and its time for new methods.

 

2. Many newbies have been bitten by less reputable breeders who sell them their useless stock. These newbies then either fade away in disillusionment or they dont come back to buy again. They may see everyone as the same as the breeder who sold the bad birds and then have no trust in other club members.

 

3. The world just gets real busy and many member have weekend commitments that mess up club meeting dates. Attendance is down.

 

4. Financial....for sure. We all know thats a major player.

 

 

theres a zillion reasons why the hobby is in decline and it isnt all down to auctions and prices of birds.

Edited October 25, 2010 by KAZ

[splat 0]

I think auctions don't help. But I think the hobby is declining because of the price of birds, you need to have heaps of money to get any where in this hoppy.

I have been lucky that a local breeder sold Greg my wow bird A 3 year old cock at the time and a violet hen for $15.00 dollars.

The wow bird was kept by the breeder for 3 years and then I got him and he is what has gave me my winning birds. If it wasn't for that bird I would be still struggling.

[kochy23 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

 

You were definitely well treated, thats partly why i asked who it was lol. I know quite a few of the NZ breeders and the local prices so you should be well pleased with what you got. $30 each is an absolute steal, although for a beginner its just what you need. Go back to that breeder when you've bred a few birds and need outcrosses.

 

definitely what part of nz are you from dean?

Edited October 25, 2010 by KAZ

[Dellouisa 0]

Do you have a picture of your "wow" bird Splat? I would love to see him.

[PJI 0]

Are auctions killing our hobby, let me explain: up until two years ago, I could ring most of Victorias top breeders and say " I have a begginner who wants a few pairs." I could take that begginner to visit the breeder and for $200-$400 a bird they could buy some breeding stock say 5 pairs. Now if I ring the same breebers they say so me,"sorry mate, I can't help you. If I sell your begginer 5 pair I'll get $3000, but if I put the same ten birds up for auction I might get $10,000." Given that this is a true and valid argument, my question is how many honest fanciers are going to be prevented from even starting in the hobby, because of the expense. And how does a parent give their teenage child the opportunity to try breeding budgerigars as a hobby. Call me old fashioned, but my concern is real as I've spent over 40 years in administration of Budgerigar Clubs.

I think auctions have there place clearwing,you can still get a bargain at times.That said ,you can also get a bargain directly from a breeder who himself has bought birds off the top breeders & save money.The three cocks in the picture below cost me $50 each ,all blue ringers & usefull cocks they all have some growing to do yet & should improve.

 

[**KAZ** 0]

Prices and costs are a KILLER but they are NOT the only reason the hobby is in decline.

[Dean_NZ 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

 

You were definitely well treated, thats partly why i asked who it was lol. I know quite a few of the NZ breeders and the local prices so you should be well pleased with what you got. $30 each is an absolute steal, although for a beginner its just what you need. Go back to that breeder when you've bred a few birds and need outcrosses.

 

definitely what part of nz are you from dean?

 

Im in hamilton, but I got my best birds from Tauranga and have travelled a bit to see whats around. Will probably do some more travelling soon.

[kochy23 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

 

You were definitely well treated, thats partly why i asked who it was lol. I know quite a few of the NZ breeders and the local prices so you should be well pleased with what you got. $30 each is an absolute steal, although for a beginner its just what you need. Go back to that breeder when you've bred a few birds and need outcrosses.

 

definitely what part of nz are you from dean?

 

Im in hamilton, but I got my best birds from Tauranga and have travelled a bit to see whats around. Will probably do some more travelling soon.

 

i received an email from a breeder in hamilton who was selling alot of their stock because they were moving if you didnt already know?

[Squeak_Crumble 0]

Are auctions killing our hobby, let me explain: up until two years ago, I could ring most of Victorias top breeders and say " I have a begginner who wants a few pairs." I could take that begginner to visit the breeder and for $200-$400 a bird they could buy some breeding stock say 5 pairs. Now if I ring the same breebers they say so me,"sorry mate, I can't help you. If I sell your begginer 5 pair I'll get $3000, but if I put the same ten birds up for auction I might get $10,000." Given that this is a true and valid argument, my question is how many honest fanciers are going to be prevented from even starting in the hobby, because of the expense. And how does a parent give their teenage child the opportunity to try breeding budgerigars as a hobby. Call me old fashioned, but my concern is real as I've spent over 40 years in administration of Budgerigar Clubs.

 

My parents give me opputunities, and I earn all the money I spend on birds in my job. My parents strongly belive that us kids should earn our stuff, not be given it. But on occasions were I buy a new aviary ( $250) my parents recognised that it is alot of money for someone my age to raise, so they paid for $50 of it ( not much, but some )

[JimmyBanks 0]

I must admit I love the Auctions, don't get me wrong, I'm a bit miffed at the prices some people pay but hey, it's their money not mine.

 

I think it's more like not keeping up with the times that is killing it... When's the Budgerigar program going to come out with an iPhone app version or the like? I just wish I was a Computer Programmer, then I could buy a Clint Ault (bad spelling I think) bird with the money I made from royalties...

 

People actually have virtual fish tanks where they breed fish and you can see what you'd come out with... Not my cup of tea, but with the amount that is known with budgie genetics you could have a virtual aviary. It's not everyones cup of tea but I guarantee some kids will get on it and become fascinated with budgies and want to join clubs...

 

Just my 2 cents worth...

[GenericBlue 0]

I must admit I love the Auctions, don't get me wrong, I'm a bit miffed at the prices some people pay but hey, it's their money not mine.

 

I think it's more like not keeping up with the times that is killing it... When's the Budgerigar program going to come out with an iPhone app version or the like? I just wish I was a Computer Programmer, then I could buy a Clint Ault (bad spelling I think) bird with the money I made from royalties...

 

People actually have virtual fish tanks where they breed fish and you can see what you'd come out with... Not my cup of tea, but with the amount that is known with budgie genetics you could have a virtual aviary. It's not everyones cup of tea but I guarantee some kids will get on it and become fascinated with budgies and want to join clubs...

 

Just my 2 cents worth...

 

 

lol thats ace a vertral flock mmm maybe i could sell out and still breed good birds and not have to clean or feed them

mm sounds good to me ha ha ha

 

okay well my thoughts are

i think not enough breeders are given recognition for helping out beginners

when i first started i had the wonderful support of mr j rowe and his brothers (rowe bros i got very good birds for very good prices and all have done me well

i was even gifted a grey normal / nothing to help me with my albinos ,i then met mr borg and mr skivington whom also helped me out with some lovely birds for very cheep i think i payed 70 for around 7 birds

ive had great support from gina house with great birds at great prices

and gary armstrong their in different state

kaz has supported me many times and just recently again but when i first began she sent me for free for my birthday 4 very handy birds

all of whom three people i talk to regularly for advice or suggestions

 

just today i had someone come over to see how my programs is going a bit of support and a bit of a mentor and to ask me what the *** did i think when i payed 50 for that bird and that one and that one and .... lol i thought i needed hens was my answer

lol also helped me cull a few birds and realize that i dont need to buy more lol

(i think hes said this about 10 times now ) and then he even just spur of the moment helped me by building a frame and fitting it onto my sky light and covering it with double layer of shade cloth

its something i really wanted for a while and as hes alot taller than me he could really feel the heat of the sun through it

so if thats not helping a beginner i dont know what is

it took him like maybe half hour and most probably save me losing chicks and birds from heat while i wait for my windows to be installed

ive also had running suport from colin Flanagan via email and a nother person whom ill also keep un named

out of these people most are not in my club yet still very happy to help me and support me i think all of these people have gifted me birds some where along the line and all these birds have been useful and very nice

yes i got hussled at the start by a few people but i simply dont deal with them anymore

 

you do not need to pay big money for big name birds

you just need to hunt around or ask others if they know others whom may have what you need you also need to be very choosie and stick to your comphet price

auctions are fun they are where you meet the big boys and then contact them on your own bat latter

theirs always someone with something worth it and cheep yes their are some whom only sell through auction but i think you will find that if you approached some of these people youd be suprized by the responce you would recive ... i know i was and i was also s.. hitting myself too but you know what im glad i did as i have a great few supporters now and a grat little flock i may never get a name but i know what my birds are worth and i know also when to help others as ive been helpped

 

i think more credit to the more established breeders is needed as not commending them that is how the hobby will die

birds are not cheep and its not the bird bit that cost the most its everything else to maintain them

 

oh just to say

clearwing also pointed me in the right direction when i was lossing birds and his helpful info helpped me on my way to solving my issues

thank you mate

i say auctions are what you make them

and a chance to see quality others are after

[Dean_NZ 0]

id agree but the breeder i saw on saturday said to me the birds i brought were worth 150 each and he gave them to me for 30 each so there are still some breeders out there who arent all about making money and remember what its like to start out. but i definitely understand what you guys are saying.

 

 

 

You were definitely well treated, thats partly why i asked who it was lol. I know quite a few of the NZ breeders and the local prices so you should be well pleased with what you got. $30 each is an absolute steal, although for a beginner its just what you need. Go back to that breeder when you've bred a few birds and need outcrosses.

 

definitely what part of nz are you from dean?

 

Im in hamilton, but I got my best birds from Tauranga and have travelled a bit to see whats around. Will probably do some more travelling soon.

 

i received an email from a breeder in hamilton who was selling alot of their stock because they were moving if you didnt already know?

 

Yes that will be from Tony and Robyn. I have some of their line. I think their best feature is actually that the hens (at least the ones i've had from her) lay around 10 eggs a piece. As a general rule their birds lack the length that other top breeders have, but they have good width/feather/spot and other features. I can tell you more in private if you like, but definitely some good birds to be had from there if you were to get in quick. I am crossing some of my tauranga birds with a couple of grinter hens at the moment, will be crossing back to the tauranga stock but the grinter hens should produce numbers for me.

[chookbreeder9 0]

I don't think auctions are a deterent to entering the hobby.

 

When I started, I started with the usual beginner quality stock costing me $20 - 40. My best birds trace back to these birds. Until 2 weeks ago, I had never spent a lot on birds. At the Western Suburbs auction I purchased 3 birds that were very expensive. To do this, I have had to sell a lot of birds to cover the cost. The old adage, sell 10 to buy 1. I was chasing a feature that my birds can produce, but I want them to do it more consistently, so I selected these birds from a stud that has a reputation for producing the feature time and time again.

 

Beginners need patience, luck and skill. If they are well off, they can purchase expensive birds, but without the skill or patience (a $1000 bird is no guarantee of success) they will not get anywhere. They need to start at the bottom and work their way up. Bank the money from your culls and re-invest it wisely. I love the birds PJI has pictured in this thread. I could use some of that $50 action. Nice active feather and plenty of backskull!

 

From where I sit there are two things that are contributing to the decline of the hobby. The first is the size of house blocks in the new suburbs. These would average between 400 and 600 sq meters. Not a hope of having a house and birdroom and flights.

 

Secondly, this urban population does not have the interest in animals and breeding as previous generations have. TV, internet, xbox, wii, etc all compete for young peoples time. Breeding budgies is nerdy and wanky, Super Mario (not Capasso), warhammer, call of duty and halo are cool - budgies are for geeks and losers.

 

Cheers fellow budgie geeks!

 

PT

[GenericBlue 0]

I don't think auctions are a deterent to entering the hobby.

 

When I started, I started with the usual beginner quality stock costing me $20 - 40. My best birds trace back to these birds. Until 2 weeks ago, I had never spent a lot on birds. At the Western Suburbs auction I purchased 3 birds that were very expensive. To do this, I have had to sell a lot of birds to cover the cost. The old adage, sell 10 to buy 1. I was chasing a feature that my birds can produce, but I want them to do it more consistently, so I selected these birds from a stud that has a reputation for producing the feature time and time again.

 

Beginners need patience, luck and skill. If they are well off, they can purchase expensive birds, but without the skill or patience (a $1000 bird is no guarantee of success) they will not get anywhere. They need to start at the bottom and work their way up. Bank the money from your culls and re-invest it wisely. I love the birds PJI has pictured in this thread. I could use some of that $50 action. Nice active feather and plenty of backskull!

 

From where I sit there are two things that are contributing to the decline of the hobby. The first is the size of house blocks in the new suburbs. These would average between 400 and 600 sq meters. Not a hope of having a house and birdroom and flights.

 

Secondly, this urban population does not have the interest in animals and breeding as previous generations have. TV, internet, xbox, wii, etc all compete for young peoples time. Breeding budgies is nerdy and wanky, Super Mario (not Capasso), warhammer, call of duty and halo are cool - budgies are for geeks and losers.

 

Cheers fellow budgie geeks!

 

PT

 

oh pt you forgot also

men these days that breed budgies by teenage boys eyes are gay oh no did i say gay lol sorry to all but its the word around the house i have full of tanager boys that son has over they always saying any male over 12 whom breeds birds must be oh......

 

 

i do agree pt even jimmy suggested vetrial budgies

i just dont think it will cut it

you either do or dont breed em

and as they do take up time time also is a big factor

Edited October 25, 2010 by GenericBlue

[JimmyBanks 0]

I think you're spot on there PT. Big houses with big TV's on small blocks is the way of the future I'm afraid...

[clearwing 0]

I don't think auctions are a deterent to entering the hobby.

 

When I started, I started with the usual beginner quality stock costing me $20 - 40. My best birds trace back to these birds. Until 2 weeks ago, I had never spent a lot on birds. At the Western Suburbs auction I purchased 3 birds that were very expensive. To do this, I have had to sell a lot of birds to cover the cost. The old adage, sell 10 to buy 1. I was chasing a feature that my birds can produce, but I want them to do it more consistently, so I selected these birds from a stud that has a reputation for producing the feature time and time again.

 

Beginners need patience, luck and skill. If they are well off, they can purchase expensive birds, but without the skill or patience (a $1000 bird is no guarantee of success) they will not get anywhere. They need to start at the bottom and work their way up. Bank the money from your culls and re-invest it wisely. I love the birds PJI has pictured in this thread. I could use some of that $50 action. Nice active feather and plenty of backskull!

 

From where I sit there are two things that are contributing to the decline of the hobby. The first is the size of house blocks in the new suburbs. These would average between 400 and 600 sq meters. Not a hope of having a house and birdroom and flights.

 

Secondly, this urban population does not have the interest in animals and breeding as previous generations have. TV, internet, xbox, wii, etc all compete for young peoples time. Breeding budgies is nerdy and wanky, Super Mario (not Capasso), warhammer, call of duty and halo are cool - budgies are for geeks and losers.

 

Cheers fellow budgie geeks!

 

PT

 

 

Thanks for your replies folks, I knew thisa thread would spark conversation and more importantly start people thinking how to revamp our hobby. Love your ideas Jimmy Banks now who do we know that could proiduce such programs. Keep up the replies folks and think outside the square, we have a committee here in Victoria trying to come up with fresh ideas to attract members. Cheers Clearwing

 

I don't think auctions are a deterent to entering the hobby.

 

When I started, I started with the usual beginner quality stock costing me $20 - 40. My best birds trace back to these birds. Until 2 weeks ago, I had never spent a lot on birds. At the Western Suburbs auction I purchased 3 birds that were very expensive. To do this, I have had to sell a lot of birds to cover the cost. The old adage, sell 10 to buy 1. I was chasing a feature that my birds can produce, but I want them to do it more consistently, so I selected these birds from a stud that has a reputation for producing the feature time and time again.

 

Beginners need patience, luck and skill. If they are well off, they can purchase expensive birds, but without the skill or patience (a $1000 bird is no guarantee of success) they will not get anywhere. They need to start at the bottom and work their way up. Bank the money from your culls and re-invest it wisely. I love the birds PJI has pictured in this thread. I could use some of that $50 action. Nice active feather and plenty of backskull!

 

From where I sit there are two things that are contributing to the decline of the hobby. The first is the size of house blocks in the new suburbs. These would average between 400 and 600 sq meters. Not a hope of having a house and birdroom and flights.

 

Secondly, this urban population does not have the interest in animals and breeding as previous generations have. TV, internet, xbox, wii, etc all compete for young peoples time. Breeding budgies is nerdy and wanky, Super Mario (not Capasso), warhammer, call of duty and halo are cool - budgies are for geeks and losers.

 

Cheers fellow budgie geeks!

 

PT

 

 

Thanks for your replies folks, I knew thisa thread would spark conversation and more importantly start people thinking how to revamp our hobby. Love your ideas Jimmy Banks now who do we know that could proiduce such programs. Keep up the replies folks and think outside the square, we have a committee here in Victoria trying to come up with fresh ideas to attract members. Cheers Clearwing

 

Sorry for the typos, have a bandaged finger and keep hitting two keys ar once. PS I don't hate auctions and have made a couple of outstanding purchases over the last two years, but I love the debate!

[**KAZ** 0]

I suggested our club run a pet budgie show and invite anyone to bring in their pet budgies......have it at the same time as our budgie show but the other side of the room. It would encourage the pet budgie owners to look at ours and think maybe of trying it out. Hoping to get new members. We could throw in some ribbons and certificates. Advertise the show in petshops and vets and the paper. Heck even get the local newspaper to run an article or cover the show.

 

My idea was shot down in flames more than once. I keep trying.

Edited October 25, 2010 by KAZ

[Matt Welchman 0]

I don't think auctions are a deterent to entering the hobby.

 

When I started, I started with the usual beginner quality stock costing me $20 - 40. My best birds trace back to these birds. Until 2 weeks ago, I had never spent a lot on birds. At the Western Suburbs auction I purchased 3 birds that were very expensive. To do this, I have had to sell a lot of birds to cover the cost. The old adage, sell 10 to buy 1. I was chasing a feature that my birds can produce, but I want them to do it more consistently, so I selected these birds from a stud that has a reputation for producing the feature time and time again.

 

Beginners need patience, luck and skill. If they are well off, they can purchase expensive birds, but without the skill or patience (a $1000 bird is no guarantee of success) they will not get anywhere. They need to start at the bottom and work their way up. Bank the money from your culls and re-invest it wisely. I love the birds PJI has pictured in this thread. I could use some of that $50 action. Nice active feather and plenty of backskull!

 

From where I sit there are two things that are contributing to the decline of the hobby. The first is the size of house blocks in the new suburbs. These would average between 400 and 600 sq meters. Not a hope of having a house and birdroom and flights.

 

Secondly, this urban population does not have the interest in animals and breeding as previous generations have. TV, internet, xbox, wii, etc all compete for young peoples time. Breeding budgies is nerdy and wanky, Super Mario (not Capasso), warhammer, call of duty and halo are cool - budgies are for geeks and losers.

 

Cheers fellow budgie geeks!

 

PT

 

PT , you have hit the nail on the head. Im a builder and 10 years back was building single storey houses on 600 square metre blocks , now am building Two Storey houses on 450 square metre blocks. there is no room for avairys. Also Local councils are now regulating or looking at what animals and pets you can have in your yard. Beginners shouldnt be buying quality birds from open breeders , they should be buying pet shop culls/ birds from intermediate and open breeders.

We live in a society that we have created through technology where young people have grown up with everything and everything is instant.

Our hobby is not an instant hobby , it is a life passion and ive seen many join my local club to sellout and leave in a couple of years. I dont think you will ever be able to keep these people in the club.

Our club raises funds by doing sausage sizzels at bunnings , this also puts the awareness of the hobby out there in the public, I recently built a web site for our club to allow local people with budgies to be able to find our club.