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Well...I set up this pair I don't think they are going to breed but hopefully they do. I might have to get a light for them. They are both in condition and she isn't even going in the nest box...

 

anyways my question is do they compliment each other? I'm trying to produce some good offspring to show in the novice division.

 

This is a Cinnamon Grey Normal hen, shes banded "2006" (she has a bad wing it was broke when she was young and healed crooked, I got her like that from the breeder):

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair008.jpg

 

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair011.jpg

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair015.jpg

 

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair012.jpg

 

 

This is a Grey Green Normal (I was told he was split to lacewing) he is 3 years old:

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair022.jpg

 

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair024.jpg

 

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair025.jpg

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee18/bi...dgiepair028.jpg

 

Do they compliment, what looks good about them...what looks bad?

 

 

Joey, I have changed your pictures to links as they are far too large, please click on my signature to see the allowable size. I wouldn't think you would want to breed again until you have built up emergency funds in case one of your birds needs avian vet attention again. You MUST put your birds first!

Edited by Phoebe
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Have you joined a proper budgerigar club yet Joey ?

Have you ordered your leg rings to ring any chicks ?

Have you a copy of the STANDARDS for showing budgerigars that would help you make decisions like these in pairing up your budgies to breed for show ?

:D

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yeah I'm part of the Essex Kent Cage Bird Society, I already have my budgie bands for 2006 and yes I have looked at the standard its just too difficult to understand.

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Hi Joey,

 

they are both reasonable budgerigars, but the most noticable fault on both is a badly hinged tail. I wouldn't put them together for this reason as their offspring will also carry this fault.

 

 

Feathers.

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Guest Phoebe
:D May I suggest you relinquish your bands, you have an ill bird that killed another and yet forge onward, that is NOT responsible breeding on your part, have you read our questionnaire about being ready to breed? http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....mp;#entry194557 You refuse to take anybody to the vet and just put them down if there is a problem. This is budgie abuse, not responsible breeding, so best you give it up for now for the health and wellbeing of your birds! :D
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Hi Joey,

 

they are both reasonable budgerigars, but the most noticable fault on both is a badly hinged tail. I wouldn't put them together for this reason as their offspring will also carry this fault.

 

 

Feathers.

 

I totally agree with Feathers here Joey. It was my first thought about that pair when I saw them. Thats why I asked if you knew what the standards are.

Is there a Budgerigar club available to you, not just a generic all types of bird club ?

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:ygbudgie: And an addendum here, if Joey does NOT understand the standards he should not be part of a club, breeding, ANYTHING!!!!

 

Have i missed something here??? :D

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Yes Julie...Joey had an egg bound hen that he didn't take to the vet and said he would not. This hen now in turn has killed a cock during her illness. There is another post about it and it is very saddening that anyone would have a breeding program without having the proper finanical means to take care of their birds properly.Again Joey....as I said in the other post. I would also reconsider your breeding set up. If you are unable to afford an avian vet for your birds then you really need not be breeding. I am sure I will get attacked for saying that but it is true. Continuing your breeding set-up without having sufficient funds to vet your birds is wrong and you are potentially letting any of your birds that get sick, eggbound or whatever suffer a very painful death. In my book that is animal abuse.(as said I will probably get slammed but the truth does hurt.

 

Julie here is the post http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....16796&st=20

Edited by Elly
adding post
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The closest totally budgie club to Joey is about 4 hours away from him. We have many budgie members who show in the club. In fact, at our show this weekend we have that budgie club attending the show with their birds, so he'll have lots of people to ask opinions of.

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Just thought I'd mention, the closest Avian vet to Joey is in Toronto, which is also 4-5 hours away from him. There will of course, be normal vets around, but I'm not sure how much help they'll be in a situation like this.

 

***

 

Joey, how is she doing now?

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I remember some post from Joey about an egg bound bird, but not all the details. So I'm not supporting Joey in his methods maybe.

 

But I just would like to make a statement about this guilt trip I keep seeing, especially from certain people, that if you haven't the money for an avian vet & don't take your sick birds to an avian vet you shouldn't breed or attempt breeding budgies. I agree that you should always do the best for your birds & not neglect them…but not being able to breed without an avian vet is pie in the sky to me…off in fairyland.

 

 

 

I know I will shock some people on here, but in actual fact things would probably be better for the Budgerigar fancy as a whole, if some people with birds that don't heal with fair treatment, were to "knock them on the head" euthanasia them instead of healing them with drugs often at great expense, as I have said on here before, if it's your one & only bird & you wish to save it's life at any cost, that's your prerogative…but to come down on someone who doesn't want to spend hundreds of dollars or even more on a Budgie worth $15 or $20 to me isn't good logic. Birds that need expensive drugs to keep them alive in my opinion should never be bred from, otherwise at some time in the future, you certainly wont be able to breed from your Budgies with out an AVIAN VET on staff.

 

And the problem is that many that use drugs to save their birds will as sure as anything later breed from them.

Edited by Norm
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:) :offtopic:

I agree Norm there may not be a avian vet in the area but certainly teaming up with a vet in your area when problems arise is better then not doing anything for a bird that was in pain. Coming here is great but not the same.

 

I am sure you are referring to me as "one of those" that give a guilt trip. My intention is not to give a guilt trip and I apologize if that comes over that way.

 

I have to say though I don't agree with the practice of the "some" that come on the boards asking for help but don't hend any advice. I don't believe everyone needs to agree with me or disagree but when you come back time and time with sick birds that are breeding I would think it would be very frustrating for everyone (meaning though that do or don't breed).

 

It is very sad that their is a price that is put in a life be it a 5.00 hamester, 20 budgie or the FREE dog that is craigslist or walked into my yard... A life is a life.

 

When the animal is beyond help, is suffering they yes I agree euthanization is the right decision. I have been there enough times.

 

Though I do have more respect for people that spend the hundreds of so called hundreds of dollars vs the person that lets their budgie die in pain or kill another one because it is in so much pain or those who just refuse to breed responsibilily.

 

Should some of the birds have been put down long ago most likely but then the same decision they make to save the life they love is it not any different then the decision that a person has to let a bird suffer. Decisions are decisions...(right or wrong)

 

It is a double edge swords for sure. The bird in the end doesn't WIN because it wasn't worth anything but 15.00 (too some people) but I bet if it was a SHOW bird that costed 1000.00 or more every mean would be taken to save its life...

 

I am sure I will get blasted yet again for speaking up for the bird. I apologize for offending you (or anyone else) because I do respect you as a wonderful member and one who gives excellent advice.

Edited by Elly
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:) Again, as I pointed out before, we basically have 3 categories of people on here, pet owners only, breeders only and various combinations in between. And all with different philosophies. Where I volunteer at the Wildlife Shelter, mice are bred and "bonked" to be fed to the raptors. I myself, can never and will never do it but I realize it is a necessity. When breeding is done on a "large volume basis", home remedies are sought, very often work and birds that have problems are quickly put down. (We also receive donations of baby chicks at the Wildlife Shelter). This is what happens on cattle farms, chicken farms and so on and is a fact of life. Joey is not a large "budgie breeder" (plus other birds) but a very young teenager, not yet able to drive, lives and seems to breed for the money he can get to put in his pocket. He only frequents the forum where there are problems and wants others to solve his problems. Many of us "animal lovers" cannot stand the suffering some of his birds have endured but yet he wants to continue;any responsible breeder of many years standing would not tolerate this behavior either. People who get pets should take the best care of them that they can which would include the services of an avian vet, proper caging, socialization and food. Joey is abusing his birds for profit, scarcely anything anybody would encourage to continue. :offtopic: Edited by Phoebe
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I support the above statements. I know it would get under some people's skin to hear that a bird must see a vet, especially if that person has limited funds on an ongoing basis. But such statements as Joey has made about forcing the egg out of his hen...the first hen he killed by doing it, and this hen seems to be okay but he isnt keeping her now. Its just plain irresponsible to have that kind of thing up here as some of our younger members might try doing exactly that next time they have an eggbound hen because Joey did it and his hen is okay ( Maybe ? ). Never mind the one that died due to its innards coming out with the egg. What a horrible sight that would have been. Not scary enough to have stopped him trying it again though.

There is a certain amount of responsibility in what advice can and should be put up here in light of young and impressionable minds in our newer and younger members. Maybe thats why you would see more advice here saying, please see a vet ....than you would like to see. Any other advice, like...."Go ahead...try and push the egg out" might be seen as dangerous advice to give and especially an irresponsible act by any staff members. Staff members have to answer to someone and would not be as freely able to advise potentially dangerous practices to a member...so I guess the staff members are the ones in a particular firing line right now. Such staff members have to advise in the hands of the very young and inexperienced that a vet may well be the best course of action.

On the other hand, as an experienced breeder, I do not ever try and push the egg out of an affected hen. Warmth in the hospital cage, a drop of calcivet to the beak seems to work every time. And the hen goes on to be a productive and happy girl in her future after a long period of healing.

I DO also seek vet advice for birds that are ill for various reasons as I have a whole flock to consider and the health of all the rest of them can be affected by one bird with an undiagnosed illness. If I have a bird with a tumour and there is no good result to come out of it, the bird lives in my flight as long as it has enjoyment of life. I had one such hen who was devotedly attended by her partner in the avairy until the day she died. If a bird is suffering needlessly, I euthenase.

On the topic brought up about euthenasia. I DO euthenase any birds that continue to suffer long after all other treatments have been tried ( not referring to eggbinding here but illnesses ). It is not fair to a bird to go on and on and never be well or get better. In the euthenasia topic I agree with you Norm. I also do not use a myriad of drugs or artificial means to keep my birds going...it makes birds soft and reliant on all that stuff form their daily survival. Thats why when you buy in a bird that has been raised on all that stuff, they often go downhill when you may not be following that particular regime.

Thats all I have to say, in a nutshell.

Kaz

 

egg bound hen topic

http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/index....c=16796&hl=

Edited by KAZ
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Oh thats nice...thanks for your advice. So basically you guys don't want me here. Thats fine I can find my information elsewhere I shouldn't have posted that stupid post on that egg bound budgie. I knew some people would flip out...big mistake.

 

I am responsible I'm not going to spend over $100.00 on a budgie I paid $10.00 for no way. I love animals and all. I want to be an avian veterinarian myself but guess what? I fixed it myself and it took a little hot water and a few drops of vegetable oil. Her hearts still beating, shes sitting on a perch, eating and drinking. She is absolutely fine and I saved my self hundreds of dollars and a trip to the vet.

 

Just for note about all these young members I'm young myself if you haven't noticed. I'm 15 and that is pretty young in my book so I don't know what you guys are talking about....

 

That hen is fine and alive and she killed a nice cock bird of mine. I wish it was the other way around.

 

I haven't been rude here and I caused a whole up roar about a stupid egg bound budgie. All I asked for is if my pair complimented...but thanks for the great advice I'll be sure to remember it.

 

Anyways looks like you guys are done here and I'm done here, make sure you go for your yearly check ups :)

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:D Yes, Joey you saved your budgie but she was still in such a state (and probably still in ill health) that she killed another, so are you actually PROUD of yourself??? A lot of good advice has been given you here but you choose to disregard it. All members are WANTED and RESPECTED here and we try to help everybody. But look at your post, you called your hen a "STUPID EGGBOUND BUDGIE"!!!! :) That shows what total disregard you have for any animal and you should be ashamed of yourself, no reputable vet school should ever take you on with that attitude. I fear for any animal, bird or otherwise, under your care. Please come back when you are ready to listen to others or become a "caring and feeling person", (shakes head, cannot believe this and feel so sad, so very sad). :( Oh and should you feel you have been unfairly criticized, we do have members on OTHER budgie forums where you have been severely addressed as well. You can run but you cannot hide, the truth always comes out, BBC is not the only one questioning your motives. :offtopic: Edited by Phoebe
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Joey,

 

you may have missed it, but I did answer your question about that pair. They are both birds of reasonable quality, but they both have hinged tails. For that reason I wouldn't pair the. They would pass that trait onto their offspring.

 

 

Feathers.

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I know that on here advice has to be given for a whole range of different “types” of people & it can be difficult. Also some don’t take good advice even when it’s given. And I don’t think that the advice to get the advice of a vet or avian vet is wrong, just that on some occasions it seems to get a little out of hand, at least in my opinion & often it’s against young people that are not that confident maybe in life & to have things get so aggressive in some instants is what upsets me. I have seen some get quite upset, which I think is unfair, even if in others opinion what they choose to do wasn’t right. As I think that’s unfair. We all have different financial situations & differing outlooks on life, I think after advice is given it still needs to be up to the person themselves what choice they make. After all it’s them that must wear the results of their action, whether that is seen by others in their opinion to be “right”. Some seem to take the position of the birds as against the person & I know they are caring about the bird, but some time the feelings of the person seems to be forgotten. I know that often the bird has little say & some do wrong by them. Not everyone makes the right decisions, either through lack of understanding, abilities or just their lot in life.

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Joey we are not saying we don't want you here by any means. Advice has been giving your actions speak louder then words. Being young doesn't excuse your actions...willing to learn, be open about what is being said and not repeating your mistakes etc...

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I know that on here advice has to be given for a whole range of different “types” of people & it can be difficult. Also some don’t take good advice even when it’s given. And I don’t think that the advice to get the advice of a vet or avian vet is wrong, just that on some occasions it seems to get a little out of hand, at least in my opinion & often it’s against young people that are not that confident maybe in life & to have things get so aggressive in some instants is what upsets me. I have seen some get quite upset, which I think is unfair, even if in others opinion what they choose to do wasn’t right. As I think that’s unfair. We all have different financial situations & differing outlooks on life, I think after advice is given it still needs to be up to the person themselves what choice they make. After all it’s them that must wear the results of their action, whether that is seen by others in their opinion to be “right”. Some seem to take the position of the birds as against the person & I know they are caring about the bird, but some time the feelings of the person seems to be forgotten. I know that often the bird has little say & some do wrong by them. Not everyone makes the right decisions, either through lack of understanding, abilities or just their lot in life.

 

Said quite well in my opinion. To me, it's state your opinion of the matter and if they don't follow your advice, well... that's the way it is. You won't force anyone to change what they'll do, or what they believe. They're going to do it whether or not we agree it's right or wrong. The way you state your opinion says more about the person you are than the message you're trying to send.

 

Knowing Joey a little, I'd say that if he had the money and the ability to go to an avian vet for the bird, he would have. It's pretty tough for a kid to have the ability/money to do these sorts of things though and I think people tend to forget that fact.

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Thanks Norm & Lisa.

 

I wasn't planning on joining another budgie forum I have been a member of Talk Budgies - left that, I am a member of Just budgies but haven't been active there because I liked this forum alot better. I don't care if you want to chase me around or what ever but I'm done here so bye for now.

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Thanks Norm & Lisa.

 

I wasn't planning on joining another budgie forum I have been a member of Talk Budgies - left that, I am a member of Just budgies but haven't been active there because I liked this forum alot better. I don't care if you want to chase me around or what ever but I'm done here so bye for now.

It is a pity Joey, that in seeing you on these other forums, you have had "trouble" there also. I see many cases where you have said some horrible things about the way you keep and treat your budgies. People have got upset with you there as well and its no different to here. The internet is a wonderful place and sometimes there is a story to be told if people just look. It can be very enlightening and educational to see the whole story in all places not just here :hap:

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:hap: You are quite correct Lisa, people show their character by the way they present themselves,

"STUPID EGG BOUND BUDGIE", of which there have been no retractions or apologies, just blasting us bleeding hearts who would happen to care. Being young does not give a person a right to be forgiven or an approval to be unethical, look at all the young offenders out there who repeat their crimes again and again with no remorse as they know they cannot be sent to jail! A statement such has been made by Joey shows no respect for Animal, Beast or Bird! (Or most folks here for that matter). If it is "tough" for a kid breeding for profit for the expense or health of a bird to come up with money that he is using on other things, then he shouldn't be breeding, some kids of Joey's age deal other commodities for money, he is a bird broker as, unfortunately it is legal. Legal, sad and despicable. This post has unfortunately become a mishmash of other issues but the bottom line is that Joey should not be breeding, STUPID EGG BOUND BUDGIE shows what he is made of. Whenever I see the name of "Joey", that will stick out in my mind, forever. :hap:

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Guest *BUUZBEE*

Going back to the avian vet part... as i've always said, dont breed if you dont have a vet. I stand true to this, but this is just my opinion, just as i dont think kids should breed birds and leave the financial burden to their parents. If I didnt have access to a vet i could trust, i wouldnt breed, but thats just me (Laughing out loud)... just as we dont breed horses without an equine vet.

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