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Purchasing Budgies


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Hi all, I went into a pet shop today while visiting another town and was asking about there budgies. The young girl there must of assumed that I was after a baby and pointed me toward some budgies in a cage wich she told me were very young. I knew that they weren't that young as the hens ceres were quite brown and already starting to get crusty (so to speak). I then told her that I was after some that were of breeding age and she told me that they would be fine to breed with!! :o I just walked out indisbelief, one minute they were babies the next they were mature hens WHAT THE ???? :huh: I think that SOME people need better educating before being allowed to sell animals! To bad if I had no experience, who knows what I would have walked out with!!!! :)

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You will find most pet shops are only in it for the money. They will try and sell you anything they can.

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I had one guy tell me that they had the babies in for about 4 weeks so I said they are what 10 to 12 weeks old? nope he said they got them in when they where a week old.... :) whatever!

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some people say the worst lies to get a sale. and its funny when us people who know about budgies can make a fool out of them. :) then they feel bad until the next customer.

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There are few and far between but most pet shops don't have knowledgeable people working for them they are usually people who know nothing about birds.

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yes i agree Elly. thats why i want to work in a petshoppe so i will have some knowlege

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That is so true! and then when you try to tell them the right facts they look at you like if you were an alien lol ..or at least that's what happened to me ;)

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  • 3 weeks later...

I think you will find its not necessarily done to get a sale. Its just because they have no idea- and presume you have no idea as well.

Bad customer service! If you dont know the answer get a manager... To bad if your it!

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Guest DrNat

I had a 12 week old hen that mothered three chicks.

She was but a youngster herself, but clearly she wanted to start early in the colony.

 

Maybe you misunderstood.

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I have never heard of a 12 week old budgie parent. It is still just a baby it should not be breeding at that age, it is no where near old enough.

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I had a 12 week old hen that mothered three chicks.

She was but a youngster herself, but clearly she wanted to start early in the colony.

 

Maybe you misunderstood.

 

A very good reason not to have budgies that are too young in a colony situation with nestboxes :doh:

 

Just because it can happen doesnt mean it should. Its up to us to take precautions like removing youngsters to another section where there are no nestboxes.

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Guest DrNat

Wild budgies breed when they are ready to. Just because we think it shouldn't happen, doesn't mean we are right.

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There are few and far between but most pet shops don't have knowledgeable people working for them they are usually people who know nothing about birds.

How long are you goiung to last in a pet

shop,if you don't sell the birds,because in most cases

you would be talking the customer out of the birds.

I surgest you find a different job,it will be less

stressful. :lol:

 

PS DrNat,you are compareing, salt & sugar.

Wild budgies,total different,they are out in the wild

& nature looks after them.Budgie in a cage total

difference,I will leave it there,because you will

be whiped, by the forum members.

Edited by macka
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Wild budgies breed when they are ready to. Just because we think it shouldn't happen, doesn't mean we are right.

 

We make the choices to provide a reason for them to breed. We provide the nestbox that triggers them to breed whether they have finished growing or not. Our fault not the birds choices. :lol:

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The current Show Bird is far removed from the native budgerigar. It is larger with a higher density of feather.

 

With the changes to the anatiomy, also comes changes in physical capabilities. These birds are not really capible of any type of great flight. The young depend on good food with high levels of protien. They need to stay longer in the nest and are slow to wean. The adults go through deeper moults and more often. During which times they need high levels of vitamins, minerals and protein. They also take longer to sexually mature, some times up to 2 years in some cases. Some of the larger buffier feathered birds are incapable of breeding with out human assistance.

 

These are some of the challenges that we face trying to breed and look after show birds......

 

.......and I love it :lol:

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But when a young immature bird has babies their are so many problems that occur. They may breed young in the wild but the problems would still occur wouldn't they?

If we can stop these problems I dont see why we wouldn't.

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Guest DrNat

Actually, this particular pair bred in one of the seed dishes, and they were also siblings. Their three offspring were perfectly healthy.

 

So because we humans think we are right and we supposedly know best, does this make the budgies and nature wrong?

 

Breeding problems can occur at any age.

 

A bit of culture shock for you! The youngest recorded human grandmother was a 17 year old.

 

This world will make liars and fools of all, best not to judge, it is a terrible human flaw.

Edited by DrNat
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I just viewed a documentary and now I know wild budgies breed from the age of 12 weeks. very interesting seen as though in captivity they are not bred until 6 months +.

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I am with DrNat on breeding age so flog me to if you so wish. In the wild they breed from 12 weeks of age. They have to in order to increase the numbers while conditions are appropriate for there survival at that time. The smaller "pet" type budgies as far as I am concerned are just not that far removed from their wild cousins. Show birds are however a different ball game not because of their size but because of a lot of indiscrimating breeding practices that make sure a good proportion of breeding problems are inherited time and time again. This is what cause the problems, not age. As mentioned by someone already old birds too have their problems!

 

As for pet shops. I had a friend years ago who owned one. I also used to work/run it on occasions. This pet shop was lucky that the owner and helpers had a good knowledge of the pets that were sold. The majority do not have that luxury. There are no pre-requisites to own and run a pet shop. Anybody can buy into one. Look at the "***** *********" franchise. Bloody ****!! excuse the french. Every store I have ever entered are all set up well and look great. That is where it stops. Staff know nothing about birds let alone any other animal in their care. I bred tropical fish for a number of years. The things I have heard staff telling people about keeping even the humblest of all fish, the Goldfish, is beyond belief.

 

Due to the staffs lack of knowledge is when you get statements like 'they were a week old when we got them'. The genuinely mean the bird is week old. They are not counting the nestling stage. They age them from when they have left the nest. Also they believe what the seller tells them.

 

Kaz, nest boxes do not always provide the trigger. Many a sole hen has come into breeding condition and laid an egg on a cage floor. In the wild the main trigger is rain which brings on an abundance of food. It is then they seek nesting hollows.

Edited by maesie
Removed pet shop chains name. We are not allowed to name stores and/or chains.
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The birds will and can breed in the seed dishes. It is rare but does happen. But I don't think we should encourage people, especially the youngsters on the forum, to try to breed the show birds at such a young age.

 

The experience breeders know the bes time to pair up. The birds will tell them. But the inexperienced breeders will try to pair up birds at any stage and wonder why they didn't have success or why the hen died.

 

My suggestion to the ones starting out is to leave the hens and cocks to 12 months old before trying to breed them. Learn what to look for in breeding condition before pairing up.

You will have a better chance at geting chicks than if you try them too young and out of condition.

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Actually, this particular pair bred in one of the seed dishes, and they were also siblings. Their three offspring were perfectly healthy.

 

So because we humans think we are right and we supposedly know best, does this make the budgies and nature wrong?

 

Breeding problems can occur at any age.

 

A bit of culture shock for you! The youngest recorded human grandmother was a 17 year old.

 

This world will make liars and fools of all, best not to judge, it is a terrible human flaw.

 

 

Not sure that breeding in a seed bowl is nature, freaks do however occur in nature, as the story on grannys attests. I think the vast majority of girls would be crippled by such an endeavor, as documented in African arranged marriages. Surely with this knowledge it is prudent to outlaw such practices?

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I've had hens nest in seed dishes and in quail nests etc.. they can find a place to nest if they want to. Been watching a few bird documentaries and some of the things are amazing. wild budgies breed more than 2 clutches a year also.

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Interesting debate that is going on here.

 

On one side, people such as Daz seem to be making the point that our show birds are very different from the wild budgies, and they should nto breed young. Kaz, and many other experienced breeders agree with them.

 

Dr Nat and RIPBudgies seem to be making the point that they have no issue with budgies breeding at a young age, with Dr Nat telling us all how she had a brother and sister pair breed at 12 weeks old, and how great the chicks were.

 

Then we have the fence sitters, or the swinging voters, such as Pearce, who are reading what is being said, and can go either way. Perace is talking about things he has seen in a documentary and seeking to apply it to the regular breeding set up budgie breeders use, without duly noting differences, or at least not commenting on them.

 

Here is my take on the whole thing.

 

Budgies in the wild are very different to their domesticated cousins. Yes, budgies in the wild may breed as young as 12 weeks, but it is unusual and not the norm. Breeding seasons usually only occur every 12 months due to rainfall, and sometimes eveyr 2 years, so they do not normally have the chance to breed at 12 weeks.

 

Pearce stated that budgies in the wild can hav emore than 2 clutches a year. Yes, that is true, but you would also not that the size of the clutch is very different. They do not have clutches where they lay 9, 10 or even 11 egss. 2-3 eggs is the absolute norm.

 

Dr Nat told us that the youngest grandmother is 17. It may well be, I cannot find my freaky and distrubing facts web page link right at the moment. Dr Nat and RIP both go on to tell us that we do not always know best, and that nature will surprise us. It sure does. I mean, humans are a great example. I know girls that began puberty at 10. Are they ready to have kids? Their cycle would say they are ready, surely nature knows best. Come on, the argument that nature must be right is not always the strongest one.

 

So we know that young birds can breed? Yes. We know that nature can surprise us? Yes. Do we know the mortality rates of young budgie mothers in the wild? No. Have budgie breeders experienced difficulties with young budgies seeking to lay eggs and give birth? Yes. Do you want what is best for your birds? Yes. Should you put them in a situation where they might survive, or they might not, simply because it is easier to leave the young ones in the aviary with the breeding older ones? That is your call. Personally, I say no.

 

To the younger members of the board, I would look for what common opinion is amongst experienced breeders before deciding to breed younger birds. Just because 2 lone voices in the wilderness think somethign is okay, does not make it right. Surely this is something we have all learnt from the idiots on Jackass!!!!

Edited by Dave_McMinn
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Dave I did not say I breed young birds I wait until 12 months like most people. Im just saying what I've seen.

I breed birds from 12 months old because thats what most people do. some breed from 10 months but I have only heard of one time where people breed 12 week old babies, and that is on this topic.

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very well put Dave, I am one of the fence sitters. I can't see myself breeding a bird before 12 months old as I will have enough problems breeding with them at 12 months let alone with the extra problems that can occur when breeding earlier... that said, I don't think that RIP and DrNat are 'lone voices' as you put it... I could take you to other forums and probably to budgie clubs where there are many breeders who breed birds from 9 months.. sure it isn't the 12 weeks that we are discussing here but it is earlier than 1 year.

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