nubbly5 0 Posted March 19, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Dr Nat a YF clearwing is definitely shown in the YF class. YF blues still tend to show creamy yellow suffusion on a white ground (just with the normals the blue body and black wing markings hide it to some degree) so you would have the double whammy of visuable YF suffusion and the size discrepancy of the clearwing making competitng in the YF class with this bird very difficult. At the present time it's a very very rare clearwing that can compete for size and head qualities with the normal YF class. None the less they would be an attractive bird. Every bird can be judged. If there isn't a spot in th ematrix it would then be under AOV - Non Standardised. So long as the club has an AOV or (in our case) an NSV/NSC (non standard varitey/non standard colour). And although I've never seen such a class NOT offered I believe that it's not compulsary for a show to have this class - well not here anyway. And in WA a bird judged in NSV/NSC cannot go up for major awards anyway. Is that the same in SQ Daz? Or can a non standard variety bird win a best in show or best colour award in SQ? Edited March 19, 2009 by nubbly5 Link to comment
Daz 0 Posted March 20, 2009 Member ID: 4,838 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 247 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,882 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 36,650 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 19/11/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: July 2, 2022 Birthday: 02/02/1964 Author Share Posted March 20, 2009 Dr Nat a YF clearwing is definitely shown in the YF class. YF blues still tend to show creamy yellow suffusion on a white ground (just with the normals the blue body and black wing markings hide it to some degree) so you would have the double whammy of visuable YF suffusion and the size discrepancy of the clearwing making competitng in the YF class with this bird very difficult. At the present time it's a very very rare clearwing that can compete for size and head qualities with the normal YF class. None the less they would be an attractive bird. Every bird can be judged. If there isn't a spot in th ematrix it would then be under AOV - Non Standardised. So long as the club has an AOV or (in our case) an NSV/NSC (non standard varitey/non standard colour). And although I've never seen such a class NOT offered I believe that it's not compulsary for a show to have this class - well not here anyway. And in WA a bird judged in NSV/NSC cannot go up for major awards anyway. Is that the same in SQ Daz? Or can a non standard variety bird win a best in show or best colour award in SQ? Clearwings are rarely considered good enough to go against a normal. Same as some other recessive varieties. I am hoping to get a Darkeyed Clear good enough to give a normal a fright. Link to comment
**KAZ** 0 Posted March 20, 2009 Member ID: 1,976 Group: Site Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 521 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 25,294 Content Per Day: 1.28 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 152,977 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 24/01/06 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 6, 2015 Birthday: 07/01/1956 Share Posted March 20, 2009 I am hoping to get a Darkeyed Clear good enough to give a normal a fright. :yes: Link to comment
mysixbabies 0 Posted March 20, 2009 Member ID: 3,449 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 987 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 5,965 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 30/05/07 Status: Offline Last Seen: November 3, 2017 Share Posted March 20, 2009 it;s all to confusing for me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! good luck! Link to comment
Guest DrNat Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 I'll see you on the show bench in a few years then I guess. Link to comment
Heathrow 0 Posted March 20, 2009 Member ID: 4,396 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 307 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 1,810 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 31/05/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: May 21, 2011 Birthday: 21/04/1974 Share Posted March 20, 2009 What was the rationale for not continuing with the AOSV class at the Nationals????? When varieties have become national classes, they have improved immensely eg. crests My hat goes off to anyone who breeds some of the harder recessive varieties (clearwings in particular). It's hard enough breeding normal varieties. Link to comment
renee 0 Posted March 20, 2009 Member ID: 4,388 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,462 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 13,420 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/05/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: February 28, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2009 My hat goes off to anyone who breeds some of the harder recessive varieties (clearwings in particular). It's hard enough breeding normal varieties. Ignorance is bliss! :yes: Link to comment
Daz 0 Posted March 22, 2009 Member ID: 4,838 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 247 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,882 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 36,650 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 19/11/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: July 2, 2022 Birthday: 02/02/1964 Author Share Posted March 22, 2009 The crest at Busselton last year was amaizing. It would rival most normals. Link to comment
**KAZ** 0 Posted March 22, 2009 Member ID: 1,976 Group: Site Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 521 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 25,294 Content Per Day: 1.28 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 152,977 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 24/01/06 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 6, 2015 Birthday: 07/01/1956 Share Posted March 22, 2009 Even though we breed crested canaries at home, I never liked crested budgies....however...they are beginning to grow on me :doh: Link to comment
nubbly5 0 Posted March 23, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2009 What was the rationale for not continuing with the AOSV class at the Nationals????? When varieties have become national classes, they have improved immensely eg. crests My hat goes off to anyone who breeds some of the harder recessive varieties (clearwings in particular). It's hard enough breeding normal varieties. AOSV class is a reasonably new one, to take into account the few rarer varieties included within it. At the moment the AOSV class is only an exhibition class at the Nationals (similar to exhibition sports at the olympics), it often takes a few years for the class to become well enough established to include it as a full competition class in the Nationals. At this stage it is not compulsory for the host state to run an exhibition class it is entirely up to them. I believe there was discussion whether or not to hold the exhibition AOSV class this year or not. The issue being that as this class is made up of several varieties, generally the only variety that got selected (due to it being generally stronger) was the suffused yellow/white (dilute). So there was no ability for the general public to acutally see the other varieties of saddleback, dark eyed clear and darkwing. In time I assume this will change. The same process took place with the crests as well, they were an exhibition class for a while before being adopted as a competition class. Link to comment
RIPbudgies 0 Posted March 23, 2009 Member ID: 4,902 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 38 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 872 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 5,070 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 16/12/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 16, 2013 Birthday: 27/10/1957 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Even though we breed crested canaries at home, I never liked crested budgies....however...they are beginning to grow on me My son use to bred Crested when he was in the fancy. I never really liked them all that much although I did breed them for a couple of years. Link to comment
JimmyBanks 0 Posted March 23, 2009 Member ID: 4,130 Group: Site Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 112 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,370 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 25,112 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/03/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: July 1, 2015 Birthday: 12/02/1982 Share Posted March 23, 2009 They certainly fetched a good price at the auction on Saturday... I don't know if that's normal for crests because they arn't as common but they sure were expensive... Link to comment
Daryl 0 Posted September 8, 2009 Member ID: 4,389 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 300 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 1,690 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 29/05/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2009 .............. The only thing you have to be careful of is the allowable variety combinations such as a dominant pied lacewing - ordinarily you would think as Dom Pied is the higher numbered class you might put the bird there BUT if you look at the standard you will see that lacewing and dom pied are not an allowable combination SO there is nowhere to show a bird such as this UNLESS the club you show at has a NSV/NSC class (non standard variety/non standard colour). This thread was a wake up call for me. I've just bred a Dom Pied Lacewing (don't ask, I knew the chances, rolled the dice and got one!) that I was assuming I could show as a Dom Pied. However, on reading this and examining the ANBC Standard it seems she will have to go in the AOV Non-standardised. The main implication I see with this is she is no longer eligible for the DP variety award, but still for the best in Section (although at this stage I don't think she's any world beater). Will have to post a picture of her soon as I'd never seen a DP LW before and I'd think few on here would have either. When deciding in which class to enter a bird I personally think the ANBC matrix (which Daz posted in the OP) is the easist document to understand and clear things up. Link to comment
nubbly5 0 Posted September 8, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2009 AND WA judges (for whatever obscure reason they chose) decided that the NSV/NSC (Non standard variety/non standard colour - which I assume corresponds with your AOV Non-standardised) cannot be eligible for any top bench awards so no best in grade, etc can be best NSV/NSC but then there are usually stuff all of those represented at our shows. This I think is a bit of a shame as it does little to encourage Novice breeders who might not have really settled out their varieties etc. Would love to see a picture of her. We had a white one on the bench here for a bit and I had the job to try and convince the breeder that it was indeed a Dom Pied Lacewing (which for some obsure reason he did not agree with - it was quite a pretty bird. Link to comment
**KAZ** 0 Posted September 8, 2009 Member ID: 1,976 Group: Site Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 521 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 25,294 Content Per Day: 1.28 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 152,977 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 24/01/06 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 6, 2015 Birthday: 07/01/1956 Share Posted September 8, 2009 AND WA judges (for whatever obscure reason they chose) decided that the NSV/NSC (Non standard variety/non standard colour - which I assume corresponds with your AOV Non-standardised) cannot be eligible for any top bench awards so no best in grade, etc can be best NSV/NSC but then there are usually stuff all of those represented at our shows. This I think is a bit of a shame as it does little to encourage Novice breeders who might not have really settled out their varieties etc. Would love to see a picture of her. We had a white one on the bench here for a bit and I had the job to try and convince the breeder that it was indeed a Dom Pied Lacewing (which for some obsure reason he did not agree with - it was quite a pretty bird. I may have a picture of that bird on my other pc Nubbly :yes: Link to comment
shannon bird breeder 0 Posted September 8, 2009 Member ID: 4,671 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,386 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 7,755 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 17/09/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 24, 2011 Birthday: 12/09/1994 Share Posted September 8, 2009 i see sume big clearwings this week and thay had clearwings Link to comment
nubbly5 0 Posted September 8, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2009 i see sume big clearwings this week and thay had clearwings Did you get the chance to buy any? Link to comment
**KAZ** 0 Posted September 9, 2009 Member ID: 1,976 Group: Site Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 521 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 25,294 Content Per Day: 1.28 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 152,977 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 24/01/06 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 6, 2015 Birthday: 07/01/1956 Share Posted September 9, 2009 i see sume big clearwings this week and thay had clearwings Did you get the chance to buy any? He bought five clearwings I think. Its in his toowoomba topic. Link to comment
Daz 0 Posted September 9, 2009 Member ID: 4,838 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 247 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,882 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 36,650 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 19/11/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: July 2, 2022 Birthday: 02/02/1964 Author Share Posted September 9, 2009 We had a yellowface lacewing spangle on the bench on Sunday... Where do I show that one? Link to comment
nubbly5 0 Posted September 9, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2009 (edited) Is that a test or a proper question? In other words do you want me to answer that or do you want other people to look it up and then answer that??? Edited September 9, 2009 by nubbly5 Link to comment
Daryl 0 Posted September 9, 2009 Member ID: 4,389 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 300 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 1,690 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 29/05/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 8, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2009 We had a yellowface lacewing spangle on the bench on Sunday... Where do I show that one? Seeing as the National Matrix doesn't recognise the combination of Spangle and Lacewing, it would go in the AOV non-standardised. Link to comment
Daz 0 Posted September 10, 2009 Member ID: 4,838 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 247 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,882 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 36,650 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 19/11/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: July 2, 2022 Birthday: 02/02/1964 Author Share Posted September 10, 2009 Interesting that... It was in the albino class and the breeder couldn't understand why it was wrong classed. Link to comment
nubbly5 0 Posted September 10, 2009 Member ID: 5,023 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,608 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 8,635 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 28/01/09 Status: Offline Last Seen: December 21, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Interesting that... It was in the albino class and the breeder couldn't understand why it was wrong classed. How on earth did he get albino out of a yellowfaced lacewing spangle - Could he not see the wing marking due to the spangles? Link to comment
Daryl 0 Posted September 10, 2009 Member ID: 4,389 Group: Site Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 300 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 1,690 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 29/05/08 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 8, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Interesting that... It was in the albino class and the breeder couldn't understand why it was wrong classed. How on earth did he get albino out of a yellowfaced lacewing spangle - Could he not see the wing marking due to the spangles? Further to that, a simple Yellow Face Albino would go in the Yellow Face class, not the Albino class! Link to comment
**KAZ** 0 Posted November 17, 2009 Member ID: 1,976 Group: Site Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 521 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 25,294 Content Per Day: 1.28 Reputation: 0 Achievement Points: 152,977 Solved Content: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 24/01/06 Status: Offline Last Seen: January 6, 2015 Birthday: 07/01/1956 Share Posted November 17, 2009 (edited) AND WA judges (for whatever obscure reason they chose) decided that the NSV/NSC (Non standard variety/non standard colour - which I assume corresponds with your AOV Non-standardised) cannot be eligible for any top bench awards so no best in grade, etc can be best NSV/NSC but then there are usually stuff all of those represented at our shows. This I think is a bit of a shame as it does little to encourage Novice breeders who might not have really settled out their varieties etc. Would love to see a picture of her. We had a white one on the bench here for a bit and I had the job to try and convince the breeder that it was indeed a Dom Pied Lacewing (which for some obsure reason he did not agree with :raincloud: - it was quite a pretty bird. I may have a picture of that bird on my other pc Nubbly :raincloud: Here is that picture of the dominant pied lacewing...I finally found it :raincloud: Edited November 17, 2009 by KAZ Link to comment
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