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Daz

Where Do I Show This Bird....

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It's great to breed that winner get it ready for the show and then find out on the day that you entered him in the wrong section.

 

Happens at every show.

 

So how do you know where to show that Spangle Opaline Cinnamonwing Shyblue Hen.

... In the Blue class?

... in the Cinnamon class?

... in the Opaline Class?

... In the Spangle class? Yes

 

So can I show an Opaline Cinnamon in the Opaline Class ... yes! (for the nationals)

 

Some Association have there own rules on this one. In SQ (South Queensland) there is a different section for Opaline Cinnamons it's the Opaline ASV.

 

You can now download the Australian Standard from the ANBC Site. The Standard - Updated

It doesn't have the pictorials which is only in the hard copy.

It does come with the current upgrades that all Club Members should have.

 

To decide were to put that bird, there is a matrix that we use.

 

Primary Colours

 

1. Normal Green Series which include Light Green, Dark Green, Olive and Grey Green

2. Normal Blue Series which include Sky, Cobalt, Mauve and Grey

3. Black Eyed Self

4. Red Eyed Self which is the Albino and Lutino .

5. Clearwing

6. Greywing

7. Cinnamonwing

8. Spangle Double Factor.

 

No Combiations of these Sections (1 - 8) are recognised.

 

9. Opaline but can have a combination of these sections. 3, 5, 6, 7

10. Clearbody But can have combinations of this section 9

11. Lacewing """" sections 9

12. Fallow """"""" sections 6, 9

13. Yellowface Blue """"" sections 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12

14. Spangle """""" Sections 6, 7, 9, 12, 13

15. Dominant Pied """" Section 6, 7, 9, 12, 13, 14

16. Danish Recessive Pied """" Sections 6, 7, 9, 12, `13, 14

17 Any Other Standard Variety

18 Crested """"" 1, to 17 as above.

 

 

So I would place a Yellowface Opaline Skyblue hen ..... in section 13 Yellowface.

 

As said some regions have there own slight changes to the Sections and you have to be sure that you know them before entering. It is very disapointing geting wrong class with an outstanding bird...

 

Added to FAQ, Click here for FAQ

Edited by Elly

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The trick we were told is to read up from the bottom and the first mutation that you get too which your bird has is the one you put it in, does that stand for most of them Daz?

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Yep as melbourne said! Read from bottom up so if you have as you said:

 

Spangle Opaline Cinnamonwing Shyblue Hen (I'm assuming skYblue hen - unless she is very shy :) ):

 

Spangle is 14

 

Opaline is 9 (often clubs will also have something like a 9a for Opaline AOSV (any other standard variety) this can be cinnamon, greywing, blackeyed self and clearwing but is usually only ever cinnamon opalines due to the relative strengths of the varieties concerned)

 

Cinnamonwing is 7

 

Blue is 2

 

So take the biggest number 14 - you put her in the Spangle class BUT seeing as she is also a hen she COULD be entered into a Hens ASV/ASC (any standard colour/any standard variety).

 

Thinking about the relative merits of putting a CINNAMON spangle up against normally marked spangles - if the hen were strong enough AND the club had a hens class, I would probably put her there instead. If she had the black markings and was a strong example of a spangle then I would put her in the spangle class (just to confuse the issue some more :glare: ).

 

The only thing you have to be careful of is the allowable variety combinations such as a dominant pied lacewing - ordinarily you would think as Dom Pied is the higher numbered class you might put the bird there BUT if you look at the standard you will see that lacewing and dom pied are not an allowable combination SO there is nowhere to show a bird such as this UNLESS the club you show at has a NSV/NSC class (non standard variety/non standard colour).

Edited by nubbly5

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I got disqualified last year at the Riverina show on my hen, I entered her in cinnamon and not AOVS because she was cinnamon opaline so I learned the hard way but then I did not no how to read the show form soon learned how and bought the stanard book and everything.

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Totally agree with nubbly5, great advice with respect to the Hens class.

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I got disqualified last year at the Riverina show on my hen, I entered her in cinnamon and not AOVS because she was cinnamon opaline so I learned the hard way but then I did not no how to read the show form soon learned how and bought the stanard book and everything.

 

 

Hard way to learn! And it's very good to have a standard if you want to show birds.

 

By The Way we are generally nicer over here :) As show manager if I pick up on a mis-classed bird at benching time I will generally reclass it for the exhibitor (even approach them if there are different options for the bird i.e. hen class etc) and usually if the judge picks up a problem and it does not disturb the judging order we will reclass it then as well. We write the new class on the cage sticker so the exhibitor can see. Nicer way for people to learn, especially Novice breeders/showers. But we ARE talking smaller shows I guess.

 

The one thing we do not tolerate is split rings or any disqualifying points. I heard from Ian Hannington after Adelaide Nats, that they were generally ignoring split rings on birds in shows and judging them anyway, hence the embarrassment at Adelaide with the split ring left on a NSW bird. Things may have changed since then though I suppose :).

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I got disqualified last year at the Riverina show on my hen, I entered her in cinnamon and not AOVS because she was cinnamon opaline so I learned the hard way but then I did not no how to read the show form soon learned how and bought the stanard book and everything.

 

 

Hard way to learn! And it's very good to have a standard if you want to show birds.

 

By The Way we are generally nicer over here :) As show manager if I pick up on a mis-classed bird at benching time I will generally reclass it for the exhibitor (even approach them if there are different options for the bird i.e. hen class etc) and usually if the judge picks up a problem and it does not disturb the judging order we will reclass it then as well. We write the new class on the cage sticker so the exhibitor can see. Nicer way for people to learn, especially Novice breeders/showers. But we ARE talking smaller shows I guess.

 

The one thing we do not tolerate is split rings or any disqualifying points. I heard from Ian Hannington after Adelaide Nats, that they were generally ignoring split rings on birds in shows and judging them anyway, hence the embarrassment at Adelaide with the split ring left on a NSW bird. Things may have changed since then though I suppose :).

It was that show manager, when I realised every told me to ask him to change it but he said no and when the judge eventually got around to judging her he noticed and asked the judge did he want to change her because I was a beginner and he said no. The club I am in now I noticed last year the changed a few around for other people.

I think it depends on the manager etc.

That's hen I just won Adult opposit sex with. :)

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Well done!

 

Nasty nasty show manager!!!!!!! :)

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So to spell it out, You can have:

 

9A Opaline AOSV: Opaline- BleackEyed Self, Greywing, Greywing and Cinnamonwing

BUT

Opaline Spangles are shown in the Spangle Class 14

Opaline Lacewings are shown in the Lacewing Class 11

Opaline Fallows are shown in the Fallow Class 12

Yellowface Blue Opalines are show in the Yellowface Class 13

Oplaline Dominant Pieds are shown in the Dominant Pied Class 15

Oaline Recessive Pieds are shown in the Recessive Pied Class 16

 

A Fallow Greywing is shown in the Fallow Class 12

 

13 YellowFace Blue: YellowFace Blue - BlackEyed Self, Red Eyed Self, Clearwing,Greywing , Cinnamonwing, Spangle DF, Opaline, Clearbody, Lacewing, and Fallow

 

14 Spangles: Spangle- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow and Yellow Face Blue

 

15 Dominant Pieds: Domi Pied- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow, Yellow Face Blue and Spangle

 

16 Danish Recessive Pied: Rec Pied- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow, Yellow Face Blue and Spangle

 

18 Crested: Crested- anything that is a standard variety.

 

I hope I got that right! :)

Edited by renee

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So to spell it out, You can have:

 

9A Opaline AOSV: Opaline- BleackEyed Self, Greywing, Greywing and Cinnamonwing

BUT

Opaline Spangles are shown in the Spangle Class 14

Opaline Lacewings are shown in the Lacewing Class 11

Opaline Fallows are shown in the Fallow Class 12

Yellowface Blue Opalines are show in the Yellowface Class 13

Oplaline Dominant Pieds are shown in the Dominant Pied Class 15

Oaline Recessive Pieds are shown in the Recessive Pied Class 16

 

A Fallow Greywing is shown in the Fallow Class 12

 

13 YellowFace Blue: YellowFace Blue - BlackEyed Self, Red Eyed Self, Clearwing,Greywing , Cinnamonwing, Spangle DF, Opaline, Clearbody, Lacewing, and Fallow

 

14 Spangles: Spangle- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow and Yellow Face Blue

 

15 Dominant Pieds: Domi Pied- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow, Yellow Face Blue and Spangle

 

16 Danish Recessive Pied: Rec Pied- Greywing, Cinnamonwing, Opaline, Fallow, Yellow Face Blue and Spangle

 

18 Crested: Crested- anything that is a standard variety.

 

I hope I got that right! :)

 

 

Yep, looks good! Once you know how to read the standard and which combinations to go together you just need to remember to enter the bird in it's highest variety, exactly as you have there!

 

One thing to bear in mind is that different variety combinations, although an allowable combination, will have different abilities to compete against normal examples of that variety. As with the cinnamon spangle v's the normal spangle also with a white lacewing YF blue v's a normal YF blue.

 

The cinnamon spangle will often get penalized for a lack of black markings (as described in the standard) and the white lacewing YF blue will get penalized for suffusion which becomes more evident on a white bird than with a normal YF blue. This should affect the choice you make to show or not show the bird.

 

If it's a really strong bird, by rights (according to the standard) it should still beat a repectably lesser example of the variety even if it is cinnamon or what have you, but it might have to be quite a bit better for some judges even though in the standard 60% is based on type and only 40% is based on colour/markings (15% markings, 25% colour) although in reality it's not that straight forward!

 

And, although I hate to say this, if I know someone is a fault judge rather than a style/type judge or if they are a bit hot on variety rather than type, I would choose not to enter a bird like this.

 

AND it also depends on what the current goings on in the hobby is. It tends to go that when something is being debated strongly amoungst judges such as YF issues or flecking, judges seem to be a bit more heavy handed in penalizing that particular thing. Seen it here with opaline and cinnamon spangles and "the correct spangle marking", YF blues and now a bit with flecking.... human nature I guess.

Edited by nubbly5

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Double it in SQ.

 

Class 1 is LG Cocks

Class 2 is LG hens

Class 3 is DG or Olive Cocks

Class 4 is DG or Olive Hens

 

And so on.

 

Up to Class 48 AOV & Non Standardised Hens.

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Double it in SQ.

 

Class 1 is LG Cocks

Class 2 is LG hens

Class 3 is DG or Olive Cocks

Class 4 is DG or Olive Hens

 

And so on.

 

Up to Class 48 AOV & Non Standardised Hens.

 

Ooooh! Scary and must be a bit confusing for beginners. Is that your club or SQ as a whole?

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Victoria follows the ANBC matrix, i.e.

1. Green

2. Grey Green

3. Blue

4. Grey

etc

 

We dont seperate the greens or blues

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Victoria follows the ANBC matrix, i.e.

1. Green

2. Grey Green

3. Blue

4. Grey

etc

 

We dont seperate the greens or blues

 

Neither does WA. :

1 Normal Green

1A Normal Greygreen

2 Normal Blue

2A Normal Grey

and now at SWBC : 2B Violets!

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Oh I just had quick read of this and I am lost :(:( .

 

So much to learn before I start getting into showing birds. I think I really need to get down to my local club to listen, listen and listen again and hopefully learn something along the way!

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Oh I just had quick read of this and I am lost :(:( .

 

So much to learn before I start getting into showing birds. I think I really need to get down to my local club to listen, listen and listen again and hopefully learn something along the way!

Don't worry Glen, some people never get the hang of it! Literally it takes years to get your head around the matrix, not to mention the time it takes to successfully identify the different varieties. :)

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I see many Wrong Classes in the Novice section. I believe that the clubs are letting the novices down in not giving them the information they need to confidently commence their time in this great hobbie. They are having trouble with the basics.

 

Is it a cock or hen.

What age can I show the irds and in what section.

 

What the difference is between Young Birds and Nestfeathers.

 

When can I show a current year rung bird as a young bird.

 

I have gotten wrong classed on the last one. No one informed me untill the judge wrong classed the bird. I didn't know why till I asked the judge. Bit late then.

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As i said earlier that happened me last year :(

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As i said earlier that happened me last year :(

They're a lot more forgiving here in the West. :(

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We're just here to help :( You friendly WA garden variety show manager........ :(

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Guest DrNat

I would like to produce clearwings with yellow faces and wings, and violet bodies.

Would they be a yellowface or a clearwing class?

They would probably be disqualified or penalised from both classes for colour/variety discrimination.

 

Could I show them in any other variety class?

I would have thought they were just clearwings - the more recessive variety, regardless of colour.

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I would like to produce clearwings with yellow faces and wings, and violet bodies.

Would they be a yellowface or a clearwing class?

They would probably be disqualified or penalised from both classes for colour/variety discrimination.

 

Could I show them in any other variety class?

I would have thought they were just clearwings - the more recessive variety, regardless of colour.

 

You can breed Yellow Face Violet Clearwings but their wings will be white, not yellow. You would show them in the Yellow Face class but you'd never be competitive against the more dominant varieties such as Yellow Face blues or spangles.

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Guest DrNat
I would like to produce clearwings with yellow faces and wings, and violet bodies.

Would they be a yellowface or a clearwing class?

They would probably be disqualified or penalised from both classes for colour/variety discrimination.

 

Could I show them in any other variety class?

I would have thought they were just clearwings - the more recessive variety, regardless of colour.

 

You can breed Yellow Face Violet Clearwings but their wings will be white, not yellow. You would show them in the Yellow Face class but you'd never be competitive against the more dominant varieties such as Yellow Face blues or spangles.

 

Hmm...Time will tell.

Edited by DrNat

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Every bird can be judged. If there isn't a spot in th ematrix it would then be under AOV - Non Standardised.

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