floppingfish

Thanks for the response, Dave. Currently in the cage there are 2 males and 2 females. Before I removed him though, I did notice both of the other males trying to "flirt" with my sick bird's "girlfriend." Like I mentioned above, she is in a separate cage with him at the moment, but perhaps the other birds still remember she is there? Do you think this will mean that I will likely need to get another male budgie (or elsewise keep this hen separate after Jack passes)? I will work on switching up the cage tomorrow and alternating some toys as you suggested - hopefully this helps improve the situation. Although yes, there is a ton of extra space and there are 6 feeding troughs in the cage currently, which should be plenty for 4 birds. They are not undergoing a moult at the moment. In terms of training them not to be aggressive, I pretty much have just been trying to separate them when I see them becoming aggressive. It works while I'm home, but is only a short term solution as I certainly can not be home 24/7. Thanks for the advice.

I have 6 budgies - 3 males, 3 females. Within the last month, my eldest male budgie has fallen ill. We have been to an avian vet and sadly, he has a growth on his liver (cancer). He is separated from the other budgies as I was already noticing that two of the other birds were starting to pick on him & I don't want him to get hurt. He is at home for now as he is still currently eating and I have kept him with his "girlfriend" in a smaller cage as she is still being nice to him (though I am keeping an eye on the situation should that change). This leaves the remaining 2 males and 2 females in the original cage together. It is important to mention that this cage has enough space for at least ten birds to live comfortably, but I have noticed a definite change in the dynamic. Even though my ill budgie was the most gentle out of the lot, I'm assuming it's because he was the oldest, he had the "alpha male" position. Now that he's not in the cage anymore, and the other birds clearly know he is sick, it seems as though there is a competition occurring between my remaining two males as to which one will be the new "alpha male." From the point that I removed my other budgie, my 2 males have been flying around chasing each other and having "face offs," which is what I call them standing on the perch beside each other trying to see "who can be taller." As of yesterday however, beaks have been getting involved and there was blood in the cage. The injured budgie was actually on top of the other one. We separated them, examined both birds to see who was actually bleeding. I then caught the injured bird - he had cuts on both his feet (one worse than the other) and a small cut behind one of his eyes. After cleaning him up, I kept him out of the cage for a while, then let all the birds out of the cage so there was plenty of flying space & they weren't stuck in the cage. A couple hours later they were all placed back in the cage together as I was having guests come over, and it seemed as though peace had returned. There was no blood this morning, but once more the pecking/fighting/aggressiveness started again. I currently have one of the males outside, with the other male kept in the cage. Another minor issue to mention is that the male who is currently outside (the one who actually injured the other budgie) has now started to bite people, whereas he never did before - I am working on curbing this as well. My questions: 1. Am I correct in assuming that this is what is occurring? 2. Will it stop eventually? 3. Am I going to have to separate them permanently? 4. How can I make it better? My apologies for such a long post, but I felt there were a number of details that were relevant in order to explain both the cause of the behaviour and the new behaviour itself. Thanks in advance for any advice and replies.

I came downstairs this morning & discovered 4 feathers on the floor under my bird cage. Having 6 budgies, this is common enough, except I immediately realized that they weren't tail feathers, nor were they part of the general "fluff," as the feathers were long & curved. It took a little time before I came to realize that they are 4 flight feathers from one of my birds' right wing. If she stretches her wing out you can see a red spot from where the feathers used to be, and if she tries to fly she is uneven - almost as though her wing has been clipped on that one side. What confuses me is that at no point yesterday did I hear any squabbling, so I'm unsure when she lost the feathers. Do birds moult their flight feathers too? (Especially 4 at a time?) And should I assume that they will grow back, same as other feathers do?? Thanks!

To settle the confusion, Atlas is a she - much against my better judgment, I listened to the girl at the store & picked out a boy's name b/c she insisted I was mistaken & that he was male (this resulted at the time in me having a 5:3 female/male ratio instead of evening up the flock (even though I don't breed) so I was quite upset. Hence, the name confusion Although I also do think Atlas is stunning, for the hope of some socialization she must be kept with other birds - she's very much "monkey see monkey do", so when she sees my other birds playing on me she'll get curious & become "brave" enough to come over...it's quite comical to watch! Thanks for the link Elly, I'll certainly check it out. I do already keep their bird seed at the bottom of the cage, I give them veggies on a consistent basis & I buy them the expensive seed that has the egg biscuit, extra nutrients in it to try & keep it a bit healthier. Still though, I'm always open for my ideas, andforaging sounds pretty interesting, so hopefully they like it too! :hap:

thanks for the replies everyone...and Feathers, you're right, some of them DO need to go on a diet but short of separating them from the flock I don't know how to achieve the results, as I can't really limit the amount of food I put in - if I did, my lighter eaters wouldn't get anything! Any suggestions??

It's been a while since I've been able to post any photos - work has been pretty hectic. But thanks to our crazy snowstorm I was able to snap a few today. Here are Jack & Miss Galen. Casper - not too clear but he chirps so much that's hard to get a still photo of him! Sparkle Roxy And Atlas. Naptime! Hopefully my resizing worked & you're all able to see the photos alright. I hope you enjoyed them

Thank you, all of you, for the replies. This weekend was tough, as it was a bit hard to think of being "thankful" for life after having gone through an experience like that, but whenever I needed to I could look outside & see her resting spot in the garden. We buried her right beside one of our rose bushes & since it's been quite warm lately they're still in bloom, so it's quite a lovely spot.

Kaz, Thank you for the ongoing replies over the last couple of days. After not liking the signs I was seeing, I went & picked up some hand feeding formula & fed Gracie around 6pm. Sadly, the sweet girl passed away in my hands a few minutes ago. She had several fits & although it was not my first time experiencing the loss of a bird, it was the first time I had ever seen a fit. She deserved so much more time than what she had and the only small part that allows me solace right now is knowing that, if only for a day, I did everything I could to let her know she was cared for & loved & beautiful. Gracie

I agree, which is part of the reason why I wanted to bring her home. Although I'm no professional when it comes to budgies, I do know that I will at least do everything I can to make sure she is alright, healthy & happy. Sadly, I'm aware that not many people would necessarily feel the same way. :(She has two possible names: Charm or Grace, though no decision has been officially made. Kaz, I understand what you mean about the wing-clipping. I'll admit that I generally prefer when I bring a new bird home for it to have its' wings clipped (personal preference, I know there are different schools of thought out there about it), but in this case I really do feel as though she would be able to get around much better if she had the ability to fly & believe she would have greater balance.Thanks for the info about her possibly having a splayed right leg, it was something I considered as well today when I looked at my other budgies. And unfortunately I was afraid you would say it was too late. I've never crop fed, I would be willing to try it if it were only for the "daunting" part, but because you include "risky" that makes me quite hesitant to ask any further. She has tried to eat & I put some millet in her cage, but she hasn't touched it too much. I will try your alternate food suggestion & see if that helps any.I also noticed just now that the feathers on top of her head - around her pied spot - seem to be wet in spots?? I'm not sure if this is from drinking, but looking at her right now she seems quite fluffed up & her droppings are rather runny. Hopefully getting some good food into her will help, elsewise I may need to look into taking her to the vet....but I sincerely hope not. Being that I adopted her "for free," I'm sure I'll end up hearing a lot of flak about paying money for a vet, but my family just doesn't quite seem to get it....

Kaz, I have to say that I'm not 100% sure how to tell. I did feel her keelbone & it felt alright to me, albeit maybe a bit pointy? I'm not sure though how it's supposed to feel in a baby budgie so I really don't know what that means. I've included a few photos of her - but I didn't want to take too many in case I stressed her out too much. I also have some without flash so as to help her out a bit as well. From observing her today, I noticed that when she tried to walk along the bottom of her cage it was somewhat like she was going to topple over forwards, which is quite odd. I've also noticed that she grasps with her right foot a lot less so I'm not too sure if there's anything I can do to help her with that. In the chance that she hasn't been fully weaned, what can I do to help her?

Kaz, This might sounds like a clueless question, but what do you mean by "a good covering"....a covering of feathers??? She's sleeping right now (it's night time here), but she did go over & try to eat this evening which was quite promising. I'll take pictures tomorrow.

I will have photos by Saturday (when I pick her up). I too have wondered about what they have said however I've examined her myself (certainly I'm no vet!), but she doesn't seem to have any outward physical ailment & her legs are not splayed. She allows you to handle her 100% as well, does not bite at all, which I don't think she would allow to happen so easily if she had some sort of injury. In terms of the petshop making something up to get a sale, they're not getting any money out of this, I'm adopting her for free. They certainly could have held on to her to sell her to someone else - she is quite pretty, and I'm certain someone who doesn't know much about budgies would have easily purchased her. I will put up pictures as soon as I have them, so please check back.

Hi Everyone, I recently posted a question about a young budgie at a store that has yet to learn how to perch (link: http://forums.budgiebreeders.asn.au/lofive...hp/t16732.html) After not being able to stop thinking about her & after a couple of discussions with the staff at the store, I have decided to adopt her, and will be bringing her home tomorrow. From what I can tell & what was discovered from the wholesaler, she was an "accidental grab" & so although she is weaned, she's too young to perch properly & tends to fall off round perches. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions as to what I can do to help her out around the cage. I had a special needs budgie (who, very sadly passed away a year ago :rip:) so I was going to follow the format I originally had set up for her cage with a raised platform & a softer section, but was curious to see if there were any other ideas that I possibly hadn't/haven't thought of? Thanks for any input

Can anyone tell me how old a budgie needs to be in order to have learned how to perch properly?? A pet store close to me seems to have acquired a budgie that they say was accidentally taken too young from their wholesale breeder & hasn't learned how to perch yet (she has received a clean bill of health in every other aspect), so I'm just trying to pinpoint her age. They say she has been weaned from mom & dad and is eating seed without any problems, so I just wasn't sure if all of the pieces fit together properly within those details. Any insight would be great. Thanks!

Thank you for the replies, and thank you, Elly, for asking your avian vet about this! I'm going to give them a call rightnow & try to set up an appointment. I, of course care about all my birds, but I have to say that Jack is the one who "started" the process that led to me now having 7 of them - the thought of there being anything wrong with him is so worrying!! Thankfully I had a workshop this morning so I'm actually home early enough to call the vet while they're still open!